Boogie, Karl, etc. from an unbiased POV

C

Chasing9

Prospect
I just want to say I have been lurking on this board ever since I hear you all may be drafting WCS. FULL DISCLOSURE: I am a Boston Celtics fan and a UK basketball fan/alumni. I have not followed Kings basketball at all besides checking on one of my favorite player's (DMC) stat lines.

I had to make an account and post because of some of the ridiculous comments I have read from some of your (I hope few and far between) delusional fans. I saw a select few Kings fans electing to trade DMC and keep Karl, and also going farther to suggest that DMC hasn't "proved/won anything" for Sac and therefore he can be traded with no consequence.

DMC is by all accounts the best rebounding/offensive combination of big in the ENTIRE LEAGUE. I believe Davis is#1 overall due to his versatility on both sides of the ball and Griffin (I hate to admit) is probably in the top 5 as well, maybe even third.

DMC is a player that you hate him if he's going against you, but you LOVE to have him on your side. He is insanely loyal. For example, he loved Kentucky and didn't want to enter the draft after his first year. He came in Coach Cal's office and said he was dead set on coming back for the fans and school that made him feel at home. Coach of course made him realize that the NBA is where he belonged and the rest (and more to go) is history.

DMC comes back to UK often and does free camps and practices with the new team every year. He never forgets who showed him loyalty and love. That's why I am completely SHOCKED to see some of your fans would be okay with him leaving. I think WCS and Boogie in a few years will be the best frontcourt combo in the league and it won't be close. LAC will have be close, but an ultra athletic big man defensive freak (which some sites have as the highest athleticism EVER recorded at the combine) and another offensive powerhouse will be hard to stop.


TLDR: George Karl has had great players. Hasn't done squat with them. Past players hate him. Dcuz- Future HOFer and loyal teammate. Gotta pick DMC. DMC and WCS perfect combo, friends and similar personalities=chemistry =great future together.
 
haha, you're talking about a very very very small minority that are in favor of trading DMC. I would say 98% of Kings fans do not want to trade DMC. We all know how talented he is. If anything I know most people on this board wouldn't mind getting rid of Karl in favor of DMC
 
Gliesian said:
We have a better understanding of DMC than any other fan base; trust us, he's superior to Anthony Davis;)
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In my mind, they are 1a and 1b. It doesn't really matter to me who is better or who thinks they are better, but this season will be interesting because for the first time in his career, Cousins has a pass first PG and will have many more open looks and easy baskets. Anthony Davis has had good guards play with him since he entered the league. We will see what Cousins can really do with a bunch of open looks and good guards of his own. You're talking about a guy that average 24 a game with a constant double team and sometimes triple team. Can't wait!
 
It was probably some other teams PR guy or fan that has been advertising the trade DMC stuff because they are scared to eat crows once our revamped DMC-lead front line starts demolishing their puny front courts. But anyway, welcome to the forum.

Just a word of caution, there are a lot of senile old people here who will hit you with their canes at random occasions. But don't mind them, they are actually happy folks. But dementia would sometimes hit them and they would start thinking it's World War 2 again. LOL.
 
sono said:
I wouldn't mind opposing standpoints, it's not a lakersboard.
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This. I have visited some Laker boards recently and the overwhelming opinion (and by overwhelming I mean everyone) is optimistic. Kings fans right now are cautiously optimistic (we have been burned too many times especially recently). There are some, usually on Facebook in the Kings group there, who are so out of touch with reality that the rhetoric becomes unpalatable with the constant griping, sniping, and negative banter. But we shall overcome and we have an awesome leader, the Vladfather.
 
People who really understand basketball know that trading Boogie would be the worst mistake this franchise could do. And this board has been very clear about that. There was also a discussion about what we were going to do if Boogie left, and many of us would have followed him to his new team (and I was one of them).

Yes, there are some out of reality fans who would be ok with that, but that's just a very small sample of people who just have no clue what they are talking about.



Boogie is the best thing that happened to this franchise ever. Kings fans love him on and off the court. He's one of the greatest players of his generation and a great person too. Can't wait to see him destroy everyone this season!
 
Hopefully Ben can start hitting more of his open looks to free Cousins up. It will be especially crucial that he does this season considering Rondo is a poor outside shooter!
 
Chasing9 said:
I just want to say I have been lurking on this board ever since I hear you all may be drafting WCS. FULL DISCLOSURE: I am a Boston Celtics fan and a UK basketball fan/alumni. I have not followed Kings basketball at all besides checking on one of my favorite player's (DMC) stat lines.

I had to make an account and post because of some of the ridiculous comments I have read from some of your (I hope few and far between) delusional fans. I saw a select few Kings fans electing to trade DMC and keep Karl, and also going farther to suggest that DMC hasn't "proved/won anything" for Sac and therefore he can be traded with no consequence.

DMC is by all accounts the best rebounding/offensive combination of big in the ENTIRE LEAGUE. I believe Davis is#1 overall due to his versatility on both sides of the ball and Griffin (I hate to admit) is probably in the top 5 as well, maybe even third.

DMC is a player that you hate him if he's going against you, but you LOVE to have him on your side. He is insanely loyal. For example, he loved Kentucky and didn't want to enter the draft after his first year. He came in Coach Cal's office and said he was dead set on coming back for the fans and school that made him feel at home. Coach of course made him realize that the NBA is where he belonged and the rest (and more to go) is history.

DMC comes back to UK often and does free camps and practices with the new team every year. He never forgets who showed him loyalty and love. That's why I am completely SHOCKED to see some of your fans would be okay with him leaving. I think WCS and Boogie in a few years will be the best frontcourt combo in the league and it won't be close. LAC will have be close, but an ultra athletic big man defensive freak (which some sites have as the highest athleticism EVER recorded at the combine) and another offensive powerhouse will be hard to stop.


TLDR: George Karl has had great players. Hasn't done squat with them. Past players hate him. Dcuz- Future HOFer and loyal teammate. Gotta pick DMC. DMC and WCS perfect combo, friends and similar personalities=chemistry =great future together.
Click to expand...

I'm 100% with you with the DMC&WCS combo. WCS was my choice (by a wide margin) from the very beginning and I had no other candidates that made any impression on me. By the way, I routed for Drummond at the time, but sadly that opportunity was missed. Like you, I'm confident that that duo will terrorize other teams in both ends of the court. Now, when the Kings have a bunch of deadly 3PT shooters piled up, that duo will have a field day. I'm sincerely optimistic about the coming season and I find the criticism concerning the Kings roster all over the net a bit amuzing. I like to keep a low profile and let the game teach them the hard way what they will be up against. Last season also made me realize how much injuries can hurt your team effort just when you think everything is going great. I bet the Cavs fans felt it as well.
 
Interesting how people here are dismissing the significant minority of "Kings fans" that want Demarcus gone and blame him for most of the team's problems.

Not only are there some KF's here that have openly posted that they side with George Karl over DMC and that we should look to trade Demarcus, but if you listen to the radio or look online there is a very vocal minority which constantly ape Napear's diatribe's about Demarcus.

Basically, when a fanbase has had crap heaped on a player's reputation by THE mouthpiece for the franchise for FIVE YEARS, the impressions are impossible to wash out, regardless of what the man does on or off the court.

Grant Napear is the alpha and the omega of the Demarcus narrative that the Kings haven't won anything with him and he can be traded without consequence.
It won't go away until Napear goes away. Seriously.
True Kings fans should be throwing static Napear's way, boycotting the station and advertisers that patronize his show - hit them where it hurts. Show Napear his unloyal, slanderous, skinny ass can't get away with sliming the only chance this organization has to be a winner.

Until that happens, casual fans will get an earful of disrespectful, dismissive hate about Demarcus blaring in their ears 3 hours a day, at 50,000 Watts until Grant gets what he wants - Demarcus traded.
 
Chasing9 said:
TLDR: George Karl has had great players. Hasn't done squat with them. Past players hate him. Dcuz- Future HOFer and loyal teammate. Gotta pick DMC. DMC and WCS perfect combo, friends and similar personalities=chemistry =great future together.
Click to expand...
What?

He's won COTY been to the NBA finals (Lost to Jordan) and barely ever missed the playoffs....he's literally done better than 99% of people that have ever coached.
 
Heuge said:
Cousins outplays Davis every time. Davis gets daring press and has a higher ceiling.

Then again you've said Favors is better then Cousins so clearly you have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
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Just cause one player outplays another does not mean overall he's better/worse it's a styles makes fights thing, it's how you do against EVERYONE and your ability to take your team into the playoffs that matters.
 
The thing about Boogie that stands out the most to me, is how loyal he is. Because let's face it. That level of loyalty isn't very common in today's NBA amongst players of his caliber. Here's to hoping that the Kings can bring this all together so that we can keep Demarcus in Sacramento where he belongs.
 
KingMilz said:
What?

He's won COTY been to the NBA finals (Lost to Jordan) and barely ever missed the playoffs....he's literally done better than 99% of people that have ever coached.
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Exactly! We all love DMC. But we don't need to belittle Karl. He is not Keith Smart 2.0. He is one of the best coaches the league has ever seen.
Some people on KF.com seem to dislike Karl, because his basketball philosophy (or the way they think his philosophy is) clashes with their believe, how to make best use of Cousins talent.
On the other hand Thibs is liked by the majority around here, although he failed to reach the conference finals ever since 2010. And while some of this is related to Rose's injury, this Bulls team was still arguably more talented without Rose than Karl's Nuggets without Anthony f.e. Thibs got crushed by the Wizards in 2013/14. And in the 2015 playoffs he lost with a relatively healthy roster versus the Cavs without Love.
After all it's debatable, that Thibs is a superior coach than Karl. Although his team has multiple offensive weapons they had huge troubles scoring the ball for stretches (Cavs outscoring the Bulls by 20 in the 1st quarter of Game 2 in 2015/ second half of the 2 quarter in game 6 where the Bulls only scored 73points against the Cavs without Love AND Irving)
Best case scenario for the Kings would be DMC and Karl on the same page.
But I would guess, that if there is a unfixable rift between those two, no Kings fan, including myself, would chose Karl over Cousins.
 
KingsFanGER said:
But I would guess, that if there is a unfixable rift between those two, no Kings fan, including myself, would chose Karl over Cousins.
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I don't think anyone here has really said that ever either (maybe Grant has but I can''t listen to the show to know), some of us including myself have pointed out/questioned that Cuz has yet (which he could easily rectify in the upcoming season) to cash in on his talent in terms of helping a team get to the playoffs. Which is why I don't get the point of this thread it seems just like another lets glorify Cousins/bash everyone else thread.

I also don''t get calling people delusional and than following that up saying he/she basically only watches box scores and does not follow the Kings.....are you kidding me you don't even watch the games......

That POV is about as bias as you can get since your not even looking at any evidence other than computer numbers and disregarding everything GK (who's "box score"numbers are impressive) has done in his HOF career
 
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Heuge said:
Cousins outplays Davis every time. Davis gets daring press and has a higher ceiling.

Then again you've said Favors is better then Cousins so clearly you have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
Click to expand...


Actually, I never said Favors was better than Cousins. I have said the opposite many times here on this forum. What I did say, and I still stand by because I believe it is true, was that Favors was helping his team win more than Cousins was. When I said that Cousins was much less efficient on the offensive end than he is now and was totally disinterested in playing defense. Favors was more efficient, even though he wasn't as talented and is was a much, much better defender.

Favors isn't the scrub that many on this board make him out to be. He is a very talented big man that is a very good defender. Is he as talented as Boogie? No. He is still a very good player so making that statement wasn't nearly the crazy, outlandish statement that it is made out to be.

Deron Williams outplayed Chris Paul every time they played for the first three or 4 years of their careers. Is Williams better than Paul?
 
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Npliam said:
Actually, I never said Favors was better than Cousins. I have said the opposite many times here on this forum. What I did say, and I still stand by because I believe it is true, was that Favors was helping his team win more than Cousins was. When I said that Cousins was much less efficient on the offensive end than he is now and was totally disinterested in playing defense. Favors was more efficient, even though he wasn't as talented and is was a much, much better defender.

Favors isn't the scrub that many on this board make him out to be. He is a very talented big man that is a very good defender. Is he as talented as Boogie? No. He is still a very good player so making that statement wasn't nearly the crazy, outlandish statement that it is made out to be.

Deron Williams outplayed Chris Paul every time they played for the first three or 4 years of their careers. Is Williams better than Paul?
Click to expand...

Favors is no scrub.
But your opinion on Cousins is a little bit weird, from a Kings Fan point of view.
I don't think Favors was helping his team to win more than Cousins. I don't think Favors is a better defender than Cousins (I personally don't get where the whole narrative about Cousins being disinterested in playing defense is coming from). And I don't think Favors would be anywhere near the efficiency Cousins gives you on the offensive end, when confronted with the same kind of defense (constant doubles or even triple teams).
No disrespect to Favors, who has improved every year in the league and is a very good PF.
And maybe I'm missing your point, because I didn't follow your whole discussion with KingMilz. ;)
 
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IfAt1st said:
Interesting how people here are dismissing the significant minority of "Kings fans" that want Demarcus gone and blame him for most of the team's problems.

Not only are there some KF's here that have openly posted that they side with George Karl over DMC and that we should look to trade Demarcus, but if you listen to the radio or look online there is a very vocal minority which constantly ape Napear's diatribe's about Demarcus.

Basically, when a fanbase has had poopoo heaped on a player's reputation by THE mouthpiece for the franchise for FIVE YEARS, the impressions are impossible to wash out, regardless of what the man does on or off the court.

Grant Napear is the alpha and the omega of the Demarcus narrative that the Kings haven't won anything with him and he can be traded without consequence.
It won't go away until Napear goes away. Seriously.
True Kings fans should be throwing static Napear's way, boycotting the station and advertisers that patronize his show - hit them where it hurts. Show Napear his unloyal, slanderous, skinny ass can't get away with sliming the only chance this organization has to be a winner.

Until that happens, casual fans will get an earful of disrespectful, dismissive hate about Demarcus blaring in their ears 3 hours a day, at 50,000 Watts until Grant gets what he wants - Demarcus traded.
Click to expand...

Sometimes I wonder if Grant is running out of steam. I literally change the channel after about the second caller just blatantly brown-nosing him just so he can get radio time. I hear some dufus call and repeat Grant's points verbatim and then say "what do you think Grant". It is like they have a certain pathology and want approval - so they call Grant and say the BS Grant wants to hear - and so they get their approval. But it makes for trite boring radio and I turn it off.

I hope we are free of Grant soon (as a radio host - he is a terrific game announcer). Can we get back the fat guy who went to Portland instead?
 
Winning organizations are stable organizations. We can't have an argument on whether Cousins helps us win until we stop changing coaches and GMs and overhauling the roster every year.
 
IfAt1st said:
Interesting how people here are dismissing the significant minority of "Kings fans" that want Demarcus gone and blame him for most of the team's problems.

Not only are there some KF's here that have openly posted that they side with George Karl over DMC and that we should look to trade Demarcus, but if you listen to the radio or look online there is a very vocal minority which constantly ape Napear's diatribe's about Demarcus.

Basically, when a fanbase has had poopoo heaped on a player's reputation by THE mouthpiece for the franchise for FIVE YEARS, the impressions are impossible to wash out, regardless of what the man does on or off the court.

Grant Napear is the alpha and the omega of the Demarcus narrative that the Kings haven't won anything with him and he can be traded without consequence.
It won't go away until Napear goes away. Seriously.
True Kings fans should be throwing static Napear's way, boycotting the station and advertisers that patronize his show - hit them where it hurts. Show Napear his unloyal, slanderous, skinny ass can't get away with sliming the only chance this organization has to be a winner.

Until that happens, casual fans will get an earful of disrespectful, dismissive hate about Demarcus blaring in their ears 3 hours a day, at 50,000 Watts until Grant gets what he wants - Demarcus traded.
Click to expand...
:: sighs ::

And you were doing so well, until you had to resort to that bull**** 'true Kings Fans' nonsense.
 
IfAt1st said:
Interesting how people here are dismissing the significant minority of "Kings fans" that want Demarcus gone and blame him for most of the team's problems.

Not only are there some KF's here that have openly posted that they side with George Karl over DMC and that we should look to trade Demarcus, but if you listen to the radio or look online there is a very vocal minority which constantly ape Napear's diatribe's about Demarcus.

Basically, when a fanbase has had poopoo heaped on a player's reputation by THE mouthpiece for the franchise for FIVE YEARS, the impressions are impossible to wash out, regardless of what the man does on or off the court.

Grant Napear is the alpha and the omega of the Demarcus narrative that the Kings haven't won anything with him and he can be traded without consequence.
It won't go away until Napear goes away. Seriously.
True Kings fans should be throwing static Napear's way, boycotting the station and advertisers that patronize his show - hit them where it hurts. Show Napear his unloyal, slanderous, skinny ass can't get away with sliming the only chance this organization has to be a winner.

Until that happens, casual fans will get an earful of disrespectful, dismissive hate about Demarcus blaring in their ears 3 hours a day, at 50,000 Watts until Grant gets what he wants - Demarcus traded.
Click to expand...

I'm shocked that the Kings still permit Grant to be on the radio talking like that. Seems to me they could easily strong arm him out of that job. Just insane how our freakin play by play guy, the "voice" of the Kings spreads so much bias, hate, borderline slander, and baseless ridicule towards our franchise piece. Are there any other situations like that around the league?!
 
John Galt said:
Sometimes I wonder if Grant is running out of steam. I literally change the channel after about the second caller just blatantly brown-nosing him just so he can get radio time. I hear some dufus call and repeat Grant's points verbatim and then say "what do you think Grant". It is like they have a certain pathology and want approval - so they call Grant and say the BS Grant wants to hear - and so they get their approval. But it makes for trite boring radio and I turn it off.

I hope we are free of Grant soon (as a radio host - he is a terrific game announcer). Can we get back the fat guy who went to Portland instead?
Click to expand...

I do miss Brian Wheeler.
 
KingMilz said:
What?

He's won COTY been to the NBA finals (Lost to Jordan) and barely ever missed the playoffs....he's literally done better than 99% of people that have ever coached.
Click to expand...
George Karl is a Top Three most overrated coach of all time. Does he get teams to the playoffs? Sure, you can pretty much set your watch by it; but then what? His winning percentage in the playoffs is officially .432 and, practically speaking, it's closer to .364, because he's only gotten out of the first round 8 times out of the 22 times he's been to the playoffs. He's never been out of the first round without a Hall of Fame player, and half the time, he hasn't been out of the first round with a Hall of Fame player.

I've said before that I don't actually like Cousins; I don't feel any loyalty or attachment to him. With that said, he has Hall of Fame talent; whether he actually gets to the Hall of Fame or not is a different debate (because Rasheed Wallace had Hall of Fame talent, and he's not getting in). But the point is, you don't give up on Hall of Fame talent to appease a coach whose CV has twenty-six years of data that shows that he can't get you out of the first round unless he has Hall of Fame talent.
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
:: sighs ::

And you were doing so well, until you had to resort to that bull**** 'true Kings Fans' nonsense.
Click to expand...
LOL - I knew someone would call me on that term.

I used it, meaning; "Kings fans who put what's best for the team above personal/selfish agendas."

Napear has become a festering pus to the franchise on his radio show.
He has turned his back on what he used to specialize in - relatively objective, tough-love analysis and commentary to help make the team better.
He's become a mockery of his previous self, and sold out for ratings and shillery.
He bemoans the Twitter/internet idiots braying for clicks, but he basically does the radio equivalent.

It's sad, really.
I guarantee you he wishes he could go back and be the way he was in the late 90's.
That radio guy cared about his work and what he was doing.
 
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