Kings picking 13th overall (formerly the draft lotto thread)
- Thread starter Tetsujin
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Most of the downsides to Ron Holland seem overblown based on the footage I saw...
(1) He didn't shoot the ball well this year but he was going from high school to the G-League so the three point line moved back 4 feet for him. That's a big adjustment to make in 1 year. The college and international prospects were all shooting from a 3pt line which is about 19 inches closer to the basket. His shooting form looks good to me and he's already had a head start in adjusting to the NBA distance -- I don't think it will be a problem. He likely won't be setting 3pt records in his rookie year but anywhere in the 28-35% range seems plausible with incremental improvement from there.
(2) He turned the ball over too much but he's a 6'8" forward who was asked to be a primary facilitator. He doesn't need to be a PG in the NBA, he just needs to get better about limiting mistakes. That should be easier to do on a veteran team where his role is more tightly defined. Guys like Jaylen Brown who can create but generally use their handle to go get baskets are more who he should be compared to and Jaylen also had more turnovers than assists in his 1 year at Cal. He's shown a willingness to force the issue and make plays both for himself and his teammates and that's a huge plus for me because it means he won't just be a finisher. On the Kings he would be playing next to Keegan who is ultra conservative about picking his spots and limiting his turnovers. That "fire and ice" combo of personalities sounds perfect to me.
(3) He's not the most fundamental defender around (what 18 year old is?) but he's a monster of an athlete and he averaged 2.5 steals per game last year. He needs better coaching but the potential is huge for him on the defensive side of the floor. He could make an All-Defense team if he wants it bad enough. In our situation he'd be playing for Coach Brown and matching up with Fox, Ellis, and Keegan in practice every day. I think the motivation to show out on defense will be there.
(4) Apparently he's not been "impressive" in workouts according to the Twitter / X hype cycle? Boo hoo. I could care less about workouts. He's a gamer based on the actual 5-on-5 footage. That's all I care about.
(1) He didn't shoot the ball well this year but he was going from high school to the G-League so the three point line moved back 4 feet for him. That's a big adjustment to make in 1 year. The college and international prospects were all shooting from a 3pt line which is about 19 inches closer to the basket. His shooting form looks good to me and he's already had a head start in adjusting to the NBA distance -- I don't think it will be a problem. He likely won't be setting 3pt records in his rookie year but anywhere in the 28-35% range seems plausible with incremental improvement from there.
(2) He turned the ball over too much but he's a 6'8" forward who was asked to be a primary facilitator. He doesn't need to be a PG in the NBA, he just needs to get better about limiting mistakes. That should be easier to do on a veteran team where his role is more tightly defined. Guys like Jaylen Brown who can create but generally use their handle to go get baskets are more who he should be compared to and Jaylen also had more turnovers than assists in his 1 year at Cal. He's shown a willingness to force the issue and make plays both for himself and his teammates and that's a huge plus for me because it means he won't just be a finisher. On the Kings he would be playing next to Keegan who is ultra conservative about picking his spots and limiting his turnovers. That "fire and ice" combo of personalities sounds perfect to me.
(3) He's not the most fundamental defender around (what 18 year old is?) but he's a monster of an athlete and he averaged 2.5 steals per game last year. He needs better coaching but the potential is huge for him on the defensive side of the floor. He could make an All-Defense team if he wants it bad enough. In our situation he'd be playing for Coach Brown and matching up with Fox, Ellis, and Keegan in practice every day. I think the motivation to show out on defense will be there.
(4) Apparently he's not been "impressive" in workouts according to the Twitter / X hype cycle? Boo hoo. I could care less about workouts. He's a gamer based on the actual 5-on-5 footage. That's all I care about.
Hmm
Da Silva, absolutely. Dude is so polished and so ready to be every quality wing in the NBA that's not a star.
Holland? I'd need to see it in summer stuff before believing it. I think he can contribute defensively and in transition off rip, but his offensive game probably needs some time to develop.
Da Silva, absolutely. Dude is so polished and so ready to be every quality wing in the NBA that's not a star.
Holland? I'd need to see it in summer stuff before believing it. I think he can contribute defensively and in transition off rip, but his offensive game probably needs some time to develop.
Yeah. I worry about Da Silva's lackluster rebounding and wonder how he'll hold up defensively on the next level because he's not quick laterally, but he's pretty plug & play.
Holland would likely need to be slowly fed increasing bench minutes next season. Which means either continuing to start HB or still needing a trade to shake up the starting five.
Unless MB wants to try Huerter at the 3 with Fox, Domas, Keegan, and Keon.
Holland would likely need to be slowly fed increasing bench minutes next season. Which means either continuing to start HB or still needing a trade to shake up the starting five.
Unless MB wants to try Huerter at the 3 with Fox, Domas, Keegan, and Keon.
I'm not convinced of Da Silva at all. Very skinny to defend PF at the next level and very slow to make an impact as SF. I think he could be a bench contributor as a 7th or 8th man for his career because of his shooting and frame but anything special. Also his stats aren't so good as other senior top prospects. Is a pass for me at the top 20.
I like Filipowski though. If Monte is looking to finally make the pick and looks for his typical college experienced player and go big I think he should be the guy. I think he is being underrated the last weeks in experts media mocks. A few weeks back he usually appeared around our pick, OKC or Portland. I suppose he was bad at the combine and the negative wingspan made him fall to even the beggining of the 2nd round in some mocks. But for me is a top 15 prospect for sure. He shows the previous season that he could play as PF next to a interior center like Lively and this one that he could play that center role also. He improved as a 3pt shooter and in interior defense, maybe his biggest weaknesses last year.
He is going to have a large career at the next level and I like him more than any other big for us in this draft, Sarr and Clingan included.
Good passer, good fit in our system as a Domas replacement, and even as his frontcourt partner.
I like Filipowski though. If Monte is looking to finally make the pick and looks for his typical college experienced player and go big I think he should be the guy. I think he is being underrated the last weeks in experts media mocks. A few weeks back he usually appeared around our pick, OKC or Portland. I suppose he was bad at the combine and the negative wingspan made him fall to even the beggining of the 2nd round in some mocks. But for me is a top 15 prospect for sure. He shows the previous season that he could play as PF next to a interior center like Lively and this one that he could play that center role also. He improved as a 3pt shooter and in interior defense, maybe his biggest weaknesses last year.
He is going to have a large career at the next level and I like him more than any other big for us in this draft, Sarr and Clingan included.
Good passer, good fit in our system as a Domas replacement, and even as his frontcourt partner.
Since I am a Tar Heel, I think the team could do worse than to pick Harrison Ingram. The Kings might have to trade up to get him, since the draft boards have him anywhere from 25 to 44, while the Kings pick at no. 45. He spent two years at Stanford and one at UNC-Chapel Hill. At 6-7 (with shoes) and 233 lbs., Ingram can play a variety of positions and rebounds well. Much like Keegan Murray, he can get hot from three. He also majors in economics, not your usual athletic interest.
https://www.nba.com/pacers/news/harrison-ingram-2024-draft-prospect
https://www.nba.com/pacers/news/harrison-ingram-2024-draft-prospect
Hollinger has Holland 1 and Filipowski 9 on his big board that came out today. He calls the tape on Filipowski’s defense “eye popping” and says “he can embarrass smaller wings who try him one on one.” I didn’t watch much college hoops this year, so I can’t verify that statement, but it is intriguing
I have the feeling Hollinger is being deliberately spicy, though, because he has da Silva down at 51.
I have the feeling Hollinger is being deliberately spicy, though, because he has da Silva down at 51.
We don’t need a star. We need to build around Fox,Sabonis and keegs. Da Silva is amazing at understanding ball movement and can shoot as well. On defense, I’m not sure but he has good length and can at least change shots by staying vertical.
Holland will most likely be gone, but shooting is one thing that can be learned by repetition. The defense, strength, and motor of holland is unreal imo. When he is in he is the guy that can get into the key for spray threes that brown wants. He can create freeing fox up a bit for the 4th quarter.
Holland will most likely be gone, but shooting is one thing that can be learned by repetition. The defense, strength, and motor of holland is unreal imo. When he is in he is the guy that can get into the key for spray threes that brown wants. He can create freeing fox up a bit for the 4th quarter.
I very much agree. Been dueling with @SacTownKid over this topic for like 2 years now. That's one reason I've been so against a Kuzma/LaVine/Grant acquisition; there just really isn't room on the USG chart to reasonably work them in. Especially with Monk coming back now.
The Kings top 4 is set (Fox/Monk/Domas/Keegs). That's a majority of your offensive possessions. And what we saw last year, with Huerter and HB, is that there just really isn't room for another reasonably high USG player, at least not on a consistent basis.
We've got a good start with Keon, surrounding that top 4. The next 3-4 lineup slots need to be in a similar fashion of excellent defenders/spacers that can impact the game, even if they only get 4-6 shots a game. I think one of our issues is currently, those spots are occupied by Huerter/HB/Sasha/Lyles/Davion. I think Lyles and Davion qualify for my above criteria, but Huerter/HB/Sasha main value is tied to their shooting and scoring. If there's not USG for them, they're just not being utilized correctly.
So that's the task Monte has this off-season. He's got to find a way to repurpose those lineup slots/money into role players that compliment what our top 4 core do.
The Kings top 4 is set (Fox/Monk/Domas/Keegs). That's a majority of your offensive possessions. And what we saw last year, with Huerter and HB, is that there just really isn't room for another reasonably high USG player, at least not on a consistent basis.
We've got a good start with Keon, surrounding that top 4. The next 3-4 lineup slots need to be in a similar fashion of excellent defenders/spacers that can impact the game, even if they only get 4-6 shots a game. I think one of our issues is currently, those spots are occupied by Huerter/HB/Sasha/Lyles/Davion. I think Lyles and Davion qualify for my above criteria, but Huerter/HB/Sasha main value is tied to their shooting and scoring. If there's not USG for them, they're just not being utilized correctly.
So that's the task Monte has this off-season. He's got to find a way to repurpose those lineup slots/money into role players that compliment what our top 4 core do.
HoopsHype actually has Ingram going to the Kings.
https://hoopshype.com/lists/aggrega...uns-spurs-76ers-raptors-nuggets-wizards-more/
https://hoopshype.com/lists/aggrega...uns-spurs-76ers-raptors-nuggets-wizards-more/
I'd argue that at a minimum he needs to be enough of a threat from outside that teams don't just sag off him completely. Holland shot 24% from 3 in the GLeague this year. Especially on a team with Domas as the offensive hub, that would have to improve significantly for him to be playable on the NBA level.
As a starter, Keon shot 40% from three las season on just about 4.5 3PA per game. He may have only averaged 8.8 ppg, but he was enough of a shooter from outside that teams couldn't leave him wide open. They'll do that with Holland until he hits regularly enough to make them stop.
As a starter, Keon shot 40% from three las season on just about 4.5 3PA per game. He may have only averaged 8.8 ppg, but he was enough of a shooter from outside that teams couldn't leave him wide open. They'll do that with Holland until he hits regularly enough to make them stop.
What if you do though? No cap, no real assets outside of those 3. It's pretty much over at that point. Adding a star to that unit if Keegan rises probably makes you an instant contender. That's how it's done. This draft isn't the place to be looking for one though. Da Silva wouldn't add anything the Kings don't already have but would have a great chance to do well with this team for sure.
That's the thing though, I'm looking at it like this, if Keegan pans out AND you added a star? Really, you don't want that? People didn't want Siakam either. While nothing is ever definitive I mean, really? The Suns, Lakers, Pacers, all made deals, Kings stood pat. They rose, Kings didn't. The great thing about true talent is that if a coach uses it right it's always going to have some type of value. Signing guys like Bruce Brown, overpaying for a DFS, Grant Williams. As seen on TV, that's how you can get into trouble if they aren't your final piece.
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