Afflalo Refusing to Enter Game?
- Thread starter SacKings384
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The season is toast. Best way to steer it right is to play the rookies and trade away or drop half this team. Achieve enough to keep our draft pick while giving the rooks some burn so they come out of the gate somewhat seasoned next year.
Vlades attempts to build a team has not paid off this year, and the Afflalo situation is the cherry on top of years of dysfunction, but Vlade has to get some positive momentum going. Until we get some worthy vets on this team Joerger has to change his mindset and play rookies. Two minutes each in a for sure lose was inexcusable.
Vlades attempts to build a team has not paid off this year, and the Afflalo situation is the cherry on top of years of dysfunction, but Vlade has to get some positive momentum going. Until we get some worthy vets on this team Joerger has to change his mindset and play rookies. Two minutes each in a for sure lose was inexcusable.
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As an outsider looking in, I feel bad for the Kings and their fans. I honestly don't think the Kings are as dysfunctional as the media portrays them to be but when things Barnes getting arrested, Cousins threatening a reporter and now this happens, it's makes it too easy for the media to make it seem like the sky is crashing in Sacramento.
I know the truth isn't that and it's not as bad as they seem but the Kings have a really bad reputation around the league now. I was reading an article couple days ago which said Sacramento Kings are the most dysfunctional franchise in all of sports right now.
The reason I feel bad for you guys is cause the Suns went through this same crap where the media makes it out to be worse than it truly is. It honestly sucks.
I know the truth isn't that and it's not as bad as they seem but the Kings have a really bad reputation around the league now. I was reading an article couple days ago which said Sacramento Kings are the most dysfunctional franchise in all of sports right now.
The reason I feel bad for you guys is cause the Suns went through this same crap where the media makes it out to be worse than it truly is. It honestly sucks.
Yeah, kind of mind boggling. Great fans, new arena, survived a real threat to lose our team.....seems like we deserve better.
But some how for years we have had some of the most incompetent self serving names in basketball calling the shots.
Hopefully Vlade and Joeger can get this right.
But some how for years we have had some of the most incompetent self serving names in basketball calling the shots.
Hopefully Vlade and Joeger can get this right.
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I'm a little bit late to the party, but I really don't get the hate for vlade. Most posters are acting like Sacramento is #1 on every free agents board. I doubt we even show up on a radar till we overpay by a couple million a season.
Kosta, although ugly to watch at times, is signed for half the price of Mozgov and is a serviceable big man. He took a stab at filling a few positions of need with veterans that were gritty, and Barnes who was already familiar with Joerger's system. So although Barnes hasn't exactly played stellar basketball, who's to say that his presence hasn't helped implement offensive and defensive schemes? Tolliver hasn't done much to speak of, but watching the games you can see that he's into it even when he's not involved. He took a one year flyer on afflalo to serve as a stopgap until Bogdanovic hopefully comes over to fill that spot. So even though Afflalo is an issue right now, he committed very little money next year to take a chance on someone having a bounce back year. Then temple who is the only one who has a true multiyear deal and it's looking like a great signing.
Now I hate to say I'm defending Benny, because he can be very frustrating to watch at times, but please take a look at the 2013 draft and it's extreme lack of talent. The only shooting guards better were McCollum and Caldwell-Pope that we had a chance to draft. The only other good players after 7 were Steven Adams at 12 and Gobert at 27. Any draft pick after 5 is a complete crap shoot most of the time in my opinion. You can say we haven't had the best draft over the last couple years, but it isn't easy finding top talent unless you are one of 3 worst teams. Then again take a look at Willie's draft, granted a lot of good role players but again no top talent outside the top 4. Lastly you have the 2016 draft and the infamous papa pick. The top 7 of this draft was solid, but if you look what was available at the 8 pick the talent drop off was steep. He took a chance on a young and unproven big, it may have been a bit early, but he still ended up with a SG that most posters seem to like his upside at #22.
I think the Vlade hate is a little much all things considered. He's given us some financial flexibility, young players when we were seriously lacking in the future first round picks. Plus he has now come twice to Sacramento at a time when few else would. As a free agent when the kings sucked, and as a gm when the kings sucked. So have a little patience, good things take time.
Kosta, although ugly to watch at times, is signed for half the price of Mozgov and is a serviceable big man. He took a stab at filling a few positions of need with veterans that were gritty, and Barnes who was already familiar with Joerger's system. So although Barnes hasn't exactly played stellar basketball, who's to say that his presence hasn't helped implement offensive and defensive schemes? Tolliver hasn't done much to speak of, but watching the games you can see that he's into it even when he's not involved. He took a one year flyer on afflalo to serve as a stopgap until Bogdanovic hopefully comes over to fill that spot. So even though Afflalo is an issue right now, he committed very little money next year to take a chance on someone having a bounce back year. Then temple who is the only one who has a true multiyear deal and it's looking like a great signing.
Now I hate to say I'm defending Benny, because he can be very frustrating to watch at times, but please take a look at the 2013 draft and it's extreme lack of talent. The only shooting guards better were McCollum and Caldwell-Pope that we had a chance to draft. The only other good players after 7 were Steven Adams at 12 and Gobert at 27. Any draft pick after 5 is a complete crap shoot most of the time in my opinion. You can say we haven't had the best draft over the last couple years, but it isn't easy finding top talent unless you are one of 3 worst teams. Then again take a look at Willie's draft, granted a lot of good role players but again no top talent outside the top 4. Lastly you have the 2016 draft and the infamous papa pick. The top 7 of this draft was solid, but if you look what was available at the 8 pick the talent drop off was steep. He took a chance on a young and unproven big, it may have been a bit early, but he still ended up with a SG that most posters seem to like his upside at #22.
I think the Vlade hate is a little much all things considered. He's given us some financial flexibility, young players when we were seriously lacking in the future first round picks. Plus he has now come twice to Sacramento at a time when few else would. As a free agent when the kings sucked, and as a gm when the kings sucked. So have a little patience, good things take time.
Throughout the whole debate about Vlade's tenure I never witnessed any user, who acted like SAC is a #1 destination for FA's. That's what some posters make up, to discredit any opinion not in favour of Vlade's signings, as if we couldn't do any better, because of ........reasons.....and this is some undeniable, godgiven fact for the city of SAC.
Any debate about Vlade's additions was about his inability to attract even mid level FA's like Courtney Lee. It was never about stars or even above average FA's like Horford. It was about drafting players, without taking the needs of a roster into account, that already has one of the best bigs of the league, a fringe starter like KK and a former top 10 lottery pick on the payroll at the center/PF position
And the draft can be a crap shoot for the fans. It shouldn't be a crap shoot for a GM of an NBA franchise. And when his draft picks turn out to be misses or when he decides to draft without taking the need of the team into account and doesn't draft, what is considered best player available at that draft position, it's completely usual and somewhat warranted, when a part of the fanbase is losing trust.
There are very few fans here, who actually want to see Vlade gone (although it seems, that the tide is slowly turning). But there are more and more fans, who voice their opinion, that they don't understand Vlade's decisions or believe, that he could have done better. Of course no fan can actually prove, if Vlade could have done better. But the same can be said, about the fans, that choose to believe, that Vlade did the best he could in FA or in the draft.
Any debate about Vlade's additions was about his inability to attract even mid level FA's like Courtney Lee. It was never about stars or even above average FA's like Horford. It was about drafting players, without taking the needs of a roster into account, that already has one of the best bigs of the league, a fringe starter like KK and a former top 10 lottery pick on the payroll at the center/PF position
And the draft can be a crap shoot for the fans. It shouldn't be a crap shoot for a GM of an NBA franchise. And when his draft picks turn out to be misses or when he decides to draft without taking the need of the team into account and doesn't draft, what is considered best player available at that draft position, it's completely usual and somewhat warranted, when a part of the fanbase is losing trust.
There are very few fans here, who actually want to see Vlade gone (although it seems, that the tide is slowly turning). But there are more and more fans, who voice their opinion, that they don't understand Vlade's decisions or believe, that he could have done better. Of course no fan can actually prove, if Vlade could have done better. But the same can be said, about the fans, that choose to believe, that Vlade did the best he could in FA or in the draft.
I definitely get what you're saying. I was pointing that out more to illustrate that I think in most players minds, this is a bottom 5 place to be. It's hard to change popular opinion and until we put together a winning season we won't have access to even what you consider a mid tier free agent unless we overpay. I mean they were willing to give Afflalo 12 mil for this year so I can only imagine what they would have offered lee. Especially since he already has background with Joerger so the transition would likely have been smooth. Was lee really that missing piece to carry us into deep playoff runs? He's shooting well from 3 and a solid defender but he's not lighting the world on fire by any means. Far better then what we have but not enough in my opinion.
I agree that you draft based on talent, not on positional need. Every draft there are probably around 5-8 players you want on your team after you see them play against nba talent. If a GM get's one talented player in a draft then I think you can call it a success. I only call it a crap shoot because there is only a finite amount of talent. You can be like the spurs and develop all players to be something, but unfortunately our lack of continuity has probably hampered many of our picks so unless we hit, we miss Obviously it hasn't worked out so well for Willie but he's still got time. Do i think he was worth the pick as it stands now? Absolutely not, but I don't truly judge a player till he's played at least 2-3 years.
More than anything I want some consistency, give the coach and GM time to establish a culture and system. I get that patience is running thin, I'm a huge kings fan and it sucks that I haven't seen a kings playoff game in 10 years. There are many things that we could have done much better as a franchise, but for now I'm rolling with the punches and hoping for improvement.
Yes it's hard to change popular opionion, but its's the GM's job to do so. The GM is selling SAC to FA's. So while you and others might feel differentely it's not entirely unwarranted to criticize the GM, when FA additions are not all that good, even for SAC's lowered expectations.
We gave Afflalo 12 millions for what's basically a one year deal. That doesn't mean Lee would have required much more, but we wouldn't have been able to sell Lee a one year deal. Was Lee the missing piece? Take a look, what impact Garret Temple has for us and than ask yourself, if Lee is a similar or better player than Garret?
I don't judge draft picks at all until they played a few years. We are in the same boat in that regard. But I can't speak for all the posters, who dare to criticize Vlade. Some feel our draft choices were poor and they provide some solid reasoning for that.
I want consistency too and I believe Vlade and Joerger are only available in a package, because Joerger said, he is not willing to coach a full scale rebuild and Vlade basically sold him SAC as a place, where the most important pieces are already there.
So firing Vlade might very well cause Joerger to throw the job or the new GM and Joerger not being on the same page over our most important assets. This only results in even more instability.
I personally made my peace with the draft and partially with our underwhelming FA. The one thing, that bothers me is, that we simply aren't creative enough to get players, that fly under the radar. Afflalo was the obvious signing and Vlade chose to ignore all his red flags. Meanwhile the competent teams come up with under the radar solutions. That's what bothers me. As a small market with a presumed bad image, we need to be smarter than other teams.
We gave Afflalo 12 millions for what's basically a one year deal. That doesn't mean Lee would have required much more, but we wouldn't have been able to sell Lee a one year deal. Was Lee the missing piece? Take a look, what impact Garret Temple has for us and than ask yourself, if Lee is a similar or better player than Garret?
I don't judge draft picks at all until they played a few years. We are in the same boat in that regard. But I can't speak for all the posters, who dare to criticize Vlade. Some feel our draft choices were poor and they provide some solid reasoning for that.
I want consistency too and I believe Vlade and Joerger are only available in a package, because Joerger said, he is not willing to coach a full scale rebuild and Vlade basically sold him SAC as a place, where the most important pieces are already there.
So firing Vlade might very well cause Joerger to throw the job or the new GM and Joerger not being on the same page over our most important assets. This only results in even more instability.
I personally made my peace with the draft and partially with our underwhelming FA. The one thing, that bothers me is, that we simply aren't creative enough to get players, that fly under the radar. Afflalo was the obvious signing and Vlade chose to ignore all his red flags. Meanwhile the competent teams come up with under the radar solutions. That's what bothers me. As a small market with a presumed bad image, we need to be smarter than other teams.
Very true. Hopefully with some continuity that will change. I don't fancy myself an apologist so I'm more than happy to call out the bad as well as the good. I just took a look at the deal for lee and it was for 4/48 fully guaranteed. I don't think I would have been particularly with that deal, and I imagine it would have taken an extra mil or two a year going against MSG the lure of NYC. With the way Temple has played I'm happy with the result since I don't feel like any of the SG options would have made that much of a difference, and even if he's not hitting his shot I appreciate his grit on the court. I think Lee is definitely the superior player, but not enough to warrant the large difference in money.
I can understand not being happy with the Papa pick, and by all accounts he could have been had later. Hopefully whatever Vlade or the scouting department saw will manifest, but only time will tell. I was a little confused myself when it was announced.
I agree. We have to try and be a step ahead in our thinking since most other factors stack against us. Hopefully with Cap room, and a clearer idea of what we need we can strike gold this offseason. I think Bogdanovic has potential to be that kind of under the radar move that could have a big impact. It's going to be an interesting offseason to say the least, with the 1-3 being the focal point and even the 4 to a lesser extent. I think this is what will make or break Vlade for better or worse.
I can understand not being happy with the Papa pick, and by all accounts he could have been had later. Hopefully whatever Vlade or the scouting department saw will manifest, but only time will tell. I was a little confused myself when it was announced.
I agree. We have to try and be a step ahead in our thinking since most other factors stack against us. Hopefully with Cap room, and a clearer idea of what we need we can strike gold this offseason. I think Bogdanovic has potential to be that kind of under the radar move that could have a big impact. It's going to be an interesting offseason to say the least, with the 1-3 being the focal point and even the 4 to a lesser extent. I think this is what will make or break Vlade for better or worse.
I disagree on that one. My frustration with the situation has nothing to do with the relative merits of the argument. For what it's worth, Vlade hasn't been perfect, and I don't expect anybody to believe that he has. If you want to believe that he's not a good GM at all, that's fine too. If you want to spend all day every day endlessly repeating one single thing over and over again, get a new schtick.
My only real issue with Vlade has been having one of the worst drafts in moderns NBA history. We gave up assets and drafted guys that look like they'd be lucky to sniff garbage time minutes in a few seasons after developing.
Like why get guys like Afflalo, Barnes, and Koufos like you're trying to win now, and then come draft these guys that clearly aren't even close to NBA ready?
I originally liked Barnes out there for the scrappy stuff but he's terrible. Afflalo is refusing to play. Gay wants out. Our draft picks suck out loud. WCS continues to regress. It just feels like another wasted year. I'd feel better if we had some young guys out there getting experience. But we don't.
Like why get guys like Afflalo, Barnes, and Koufos like you're trying to win now, and then come draft these guys that clearly aren't even close to NBA ready?
I originally liked Barnes out there for the scrappy stuff but he's terrible. Afflalo is refusing to play. Gay wants out. Our draft picks suck out loud. WCS continues to regress. It just feels like another wasted year. I'd feel better if we had some young guys out there getting experience. But we don't.
