The "Win Now" Trade Thread (In Honor of iowamcnabb)

[twslam07]

As I've previously stated, I've been on the "tear it down and formally rebuild" train for awhile now. However, if I was GM and Vivek was forcing me to compete now, this sis an idea that could help us get there...

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DET Gets: Marvin Bagley, Tristan Thompson, & 2022 SAC 1st (Top 4 Protected)
DET Gives: Jerami Grant & Cory Joseph
Why for DET? The Pistons lean further into their rebuild by selling off their win now vet for a lightly protected 2022 1st. They also clear Joseph's salary and take a shot on Bagley (who they are rumored to be interested in) to see if there is anything there worth keeping long term.

PG - Hayes / Jackson / Lee
SG - Cunningham / Diallo / McGruder
SF - Bey / J. Jackson
PF - Bagley / Lyles / Livers
C - Stewart / Olynyk / Thompson / Garza

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PHI Gets: De'Aaron Fox
PHI Gives: Ben Simmons
Why for PHI? The 76ers move on from their disgruntled star and pick up a 23 year old PG to pair with Embiid for a championship run. Fox gives them a dynamic perimeter go-to option to balance out Embiid & Harris. Although Fox is not the best shooter, swapping him for Simmons should help their spacing. I'd recommend having Maxey come off the bench in a 6th man role while giving Embiid & Fox elite spacing with Curry, Green, & Harris next to them.

PG - Fox / Milton / Springer
SG - Curry / Maxey / Joe
SF - Green / Thybulle / Korkmaz
PF - Harris / Niang / Reed
C - Embiid / Drummond / Bassey

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SAC Gets: Ben Simmons, Jerami Grant, & Cory Joseph
SAC Gives: De'Aaron Fox, Marvin Bagley, Tristan Thompson, & 2022 SAC 1st (Top 4 Protected)
Why for SAC? The Kings balance their roster and move some of their young assets (Fox & a future 1st) in an effort to be more competitive now. Haliburton, Mitchell, Davis, Hield, Barnes, & Grant is a ton of spacing around Simmons while also having a great lob/PnR threat in Holmes to work with. The Kings would be able to end with a death lineup of Haliburton-Hield/Mitchell-Barnes-Grant-Simmons to give them a lot of shooting, athleticism, & versatility when defenses clamp down at the end of games.

PG - Haliburton / Mitchell / Joseph
SG - Barnes / Davis / Ramsey
SF - Grant / Hield / Woodard
PF - Simmons / Harkless / Metu
C - Holmes / Len / Jones

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[mrlaze]

I dont know enough about Grant.

Not 100% on Simmons, but the idea's growing on me as my Fox enthusiasm wanes.

Does Barnes play the 2, ever? Thought he played more 3/4.

 

[Hoovtrain]

The Fox for Simmons train has left the building. Maxey is playing great, and better than Fox, so there would be no need for them to make that trade.

 

[SLAB]

Bring in John Wall and Russell Westbrook!!!

 

[twslam07]

I dont know enough about Grant.

Not 100% on Simmons, but the idea's growing on me as my Fox enthusiasm wanes.

Does Barnes play the 2, ever? Thought he played more 3/4.

I wouldn't be too tied to me putting Barnes at SG. Haliburton, Barnes, Grant, Simmons, & Holmes is a lot of athleticism, length, versatility, and defensive ability. I'm not worried with that group defending opposing starting lineups. On offense, you obviously have Simmons at PG and Haliburton at SG.

To be a bit more specific, I could see the minute distribution play out like this:

PG - Haliburton (22 min) / Mitchell (26 min)
SG - Barnes (14 min) / Hield (14 min) / Haliburton (10 min) / Davis (10 min)
SF - Grant (14 min) / Barnes (18 min) / Hield (16 min)
PF - Simmons (30 min) / Grant (18 min)
C - Holmes (30 min) / Len (12 min) / Simmons (6 min)

Simmons = 36 min
Haliburton = 32 min
Barnes = 32 min
Grant = 32 min
Hield = 30 min
Holmes = 30 min
Mitchell = 26 min
Len = 12 min
Davis = 10 min

 

[twslam07]

The Fox for Simmons train has left the building. Maxey is playing great, and better than Fox, so there would be no need for them to make that trade.

I don't agree with the premise that Maxey playing well means that Philly wouldn't be open to moving Simmons (who isn't playing for them at all) for Fox. There shouldn't be an issue with Fox & Maxey sharing the court either.

 

[Hoovtrain]

I don't agree with the premise that Maxey playing well means that Philly wouldn't be open to moving Simmons (who isn't playing for them at all) for Fox. There shouldn't be an issue with Fox & Maxey sharing the court either.

I just don’t think have any real interest in Fox at this time when they could deal Simmons to bolster another position of need imo. Hope I’m wrong because I would love to try and nab Simmons and Thybulle from them

 

[jiimbob]

Philadelphia is sitting on a lot of guards as is and it appears Maxey is more successful at point than most thought.
From the Sixers perspective I too would think the Fox for Simmons iron has cooled.
Monte needs to work some magic here because this is about as low as I’ve seen it.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Those are trades that should satisfy Vivek and the majority of the fan base. That team would have a really good shot at making the playoffs and maybe even making some noise.

 

[AaronPDX]

Highly doubt Philly would even take Fox now.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I would not say no after the last week. I think the cost to get Bagley is low for Detroit. Philly is the question mark. That said they could probably turn around and flip Fox if it wasn't a good fit and it would immediately resolve the Simmons issue which I think is only getting worse as it drags on. He really may not be well though, and that is a concern.

 

[ESP47]

I wouldn't trade the first rounder for Jerami Grant. Solid player but his numbers look better than his impact stats do. I think it would sink the team further into purgatory and waste a year on the rebuild by giving away the draft pick.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Who are realistic potential trade partners for Philly? Boston for Brown? Portland if they blow it up? Atlanta for Collins, a pick and filler?

I can’t think of many other options for them

 

[Tetsujin]

Why do we keep coming up with win-now trade ideas that somehow make us worse? sure, the Kings would have 'versatility' but they also wouldn't have a single plus iso scorer.

 

[jiimbob]

In another thread someone proposed the Pelicans involved in a three team trade with Ingram going to the Sixers.
Seems like the Pels could use a PG, Fox, at this time and Ingram might make more sense for fit for the Sixers.
All speculation, but if Simmons for Fox is something were interested in this might be a way to make it happen.

 

[Tetsujin]

In another thread someone proposed the Pelicans involved in a three team trade with Ingram going to the Sixers.
Seems like the Pels could use a PG, Fox, at this time and Ingram might make more sense for fit for the Sixers.
All speculation, but if Simmons for Fox is something were interested in this might be a way to make it happen.

why not cut out the middleman and just trade Fox for Ingram then? less injury/mental health concerns. Already familiar with Gentry's system. Excellent scorer (which this team might need more than a star glue guy like Simmons at this point).

 

[LPKingsFan]

why not cut out the middleman and just trade Fox for Ingram then? less injury/mental health concerns. Already familiar with Gentry's system. Excellent scorer (which this team might need more than a star glue guy like Simmons at this point).

I was going to suggest the same thing. Ingram’s only 24, too, so you can try to see if trading a PG for a forward to balance to roster helps in the short run, but even if it doesn’t you can potentially hang on to him if you ship out guys like Barnes for picks/youth too.

 

[Hoovtrain]

Philadelphia is sitting on a lot of guards as is and it appears Maxey is more successful at point than most thought.
From the Sixers perspective I too would think the Fox for Simmons iron has cooled.
Monte needs to work some magic here because this is about as low as I’ve seen it.

you should read the Kings Herald article from this morning. Ouch

 

[jiimbob]

you should read the Kings Herald article from this morning. Ouch

where do I find it?

 

[Hoovtrain]

where do I find it?

here you go
https://kingsherald.com/articles/nba-sacramento-kings-trade-rumors-trade-machine/

 

[jiimbob]

why not cut out the middleman and just trade Fox for Ingram then? less injury/mental health concerns. Already familiar with Gentry's system. Excellent scorer (which this team might need more than a star glue guy like Simmons at this point).

I thought about that but seeing I don’t get enough exposure to games and players to make the most educated call, thought I’d just stick with Simmons for Fox theme.

 

[jiimbob]

here you go
https://kingsherald.com/articles/nba-sacramento-kings-trade-rumors-trade-machine/

Brutal but factual.
I’m still thinking Monte has the chops to be a decent GM but yeah, drastic moves are in order.

 

[twslam07]

Why do we keep coming up with win-now trade ideas that somehow make us worse? sure, the Kings would have 'versatility' but they also wouldn't have a single plus iso scorer.

I have a hard time believing that swapping the rotation minutes of Fox & Metu/Harkless/Bagley for Simmons & Grant somehow makes us worse. Below are their 2020-21 advanced impact stats to reference:



Simmons was substantially better than Fox in every one of these advanced impact stats and then you have Grant substantially better than the players he'd be replacing in the rotation.

I'd like to think that there is more to the game of basketball than iso scoring. This team would be very good defensively with guys like Simmons, Mitchell, Haliburton, Davis, Barnes, Grant, Simmons, Holmes, & Len. On offense, you do have two excellent playmakers in Haliburton & Simmons who would be surrounded by a plethora of shooters. That's going to be a large bulk of the offense right there. Yeah you don't have a primary 20-25 PPG type player on the roster, but you have numerous 15-20 PPG players in Haliburton, Hield, Barnes, Grant, Simmons, & Holmes (and I think Mitchell could get to a 15 PPG level as he develops more).

At the end of the day, this team would be successful by playing hard nose defense, getting out in transition with Haliburton/Simmons leading the break, and playing unselfish team ball on offense with our excellent playmakers finding open shooters.

 

[Hoovtrain]

Brutal but factual.
I’m still thinking Monte has the chops to be a decent GM but yeah, drastic moves are in order.

tend to agree. Not dealing Fox in hindsight looks bad, but at the time I was ok not dealing him

 

[twslam07]

In another thread someone proposed the Pelicans involved in a three team trade with Ingram going to the Sixers.
Seems like the Pels could use a PG, Fox, at this time and Ingram might make more sense for fit for the Sixers.
All speculation, but if Simmons for Fox is something were interested in this might be a way to make it happen.

The Pelicans have Graham, Lewis, and NAW. Im not saying Fox isn’t better than those guys but I don’t think they’d value Fox over Ingram considering the young ballhandlers they already have on the roster. Not sure it really balances their roster.

 

[Groovygreg]

here you go
https://kingsherald.com/articles/nba-sacramento-kings-trade-rumors-trade-machine/

So the author’s solution to fix the Kings after this season ends (barring a miraculous turnaround) is for Vivek to “cut ties” with (fire) the current FO (who has been in place just 15 months), bring in a new GM, then step back and let this incoming person have free rein to hire a coach, utilize draft picks, and find the next franchise player to serve as the cornerstone for a full rebuild.

It’s pure genius, right?

 

[jiimbob]

The Pelicans have Graham, Lewis, and NAW. Im not saying Fox isn’t better than those guys but I don’t think they’d value Fox over Ingram considering the young ballhandlers they already have on the roster. Not sure it really balances their roster.

Yeah, I’m not exactly that keen to move on from Fox quite yet but concerning with the emergence of several young PG’s he appears to be losing trade value this season.

 

[Joshoua]

We’re not getting Ben/Grant for ****ing Fox/Bagley

 

[twslam07]

We’re not getting Ben/Grant for ****ing Fox/Bagley

You forgot the 2022 1st.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Yeah, I’m not exactly that keen to move on from Fox quite yet but concerning with the emergence of several young PG’s he appears to be losing trade value this season.

You could be right but I'm not sure us fans have any idea what players are worth. Some on this forum thought Simmons could be had for Buddy Bagley and a first and now fans think Sixers wouldn't even take a 23 year old who averaged 25 and 7 last year.

Monte has indicated he would like to take a big swing, if we haven't turned our season around by the deadline I suspect he takes it.