KAT

[Joshoua]

I ignored it when NYK was monitoring him but now GSW I’d keep an eye in Towns now too.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...-warriors-monitoring-t-wolves-stars-situation

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/256639/Warriors-Monitoring-Karl-Anthony-Towns

Offer Fox/Bagley/Buddy our lottery pick this year than our 1st next year unprotected for KAT and Covington

 

[Sactown ExPat]

Beat me to it.

Bagley/Bogi/Ariza works per the trade machine. I don't think Buddy could be included until the offseason. I assume at least this year's unprotected first would need to be included, as well. KAT will be a tricky one--teams have to offer enough to entice the Wolves without completely gutting their team of talent. It'll be interesting to monitor. You also need to be close enough that KAT vaults you into the playoffs.

Edit to add: the Warriors are leaking a lot of nonsense recently, like they are also going to offer the #1 pick for Giannis. OK, Bob Meyers. Anyway, the LA teams are out, Boston probably can't get it done w/out detonating team chemistry (would need to be some combo surrounding Tatum/Smart), and the Heat don't have the pieces either. At first blush, it would seem to be us and Phoenix that could actually make it happen. Maybe the Mavs if they put KP on the table.

 

[twslam07]

I ignored it when NYK was monitoring him but now GSW I’d keep an eye in Towns now too.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...-warriors-monitoring-t-wolves-stars-situation

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/256639/Warriors-Monitoring-Karl-Anthony-Towns

Offer Fox/Bagley/Buddy our lottery pick this year than our 1st next year unprotected for KAT and Covington

PG - Joseph / Ferrell
SG - Bogdanovic / James
SF - Barnes / Ariza / Gabriel
PF - Covington / Bjelica / Giles / Swanigan
C - Towns / Holmes / Dedmon

Is that team all that much better than the current MIN team?

Also, why would MIN be interested in the 27 year old Hield?

 

[twslam07]

Honestly, the only way we should trade for him is if we can keep Fox and I find that very, very hard to believe that we have the assets to pull that off (unless we win the lottery this year). Otherwise, we're just gutting our roster and won't have anyone around Towns.

2019-20 Trade Deadline

Trade #1
POR Gets: Harrison Barnes & Bogdan Bogdanovic
POR Gives: Kent Bazemore, Rodney Hood, Nassir Little, & 2020 POR 1st (Top 10 Protected)

SAC Gets: Kent Bazemore, Rodney Hood, Nassir Little, & 2020 POR 1st (Top 10 Protected)
SAC Gives: Harrison Barnes & Bogdan Bogdanovic

Trade #2
BOS Gets: Richaun Holmes & Nemanja Bjelica
BOS Gives: Vincent Porier, Romeo Langford, Semi Ojeleye, & 2020 BOS 1st (Top 10 Protected)

SAC Gets: Vincent Porier, Romeo Langford, Semi Ojeleye, & 2020 BOS 1st (Top 10 Protected)
SAC Gives: Richaun Holmes & Nemanja Bjelica


2020 Offseason

Trade #3
MIN Gets: Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley, Nassir Little, Romeo Langford, 2020 SAC 1st, 2020 POR 1st, 2020 BOS 1st, 2022 SAC 1st (unprotected), 2024 SAC 1st (unprotected)
MIN Gives: Karl Anthony-Towns

SAC Gets: Karl Anthony-Towns
SAC Gives: Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley, Nassir Little, Romeo Langford, 2020 SAC 1st, 2020 POR 1st, 2020 BOS 1st, 2022 SAC 1st (unprotected), 2024 SAC 1st (unprotected)

I can't find a trade that sends Hield to a 3rd team for a young asset. Maybe the Spurs would want him for their 1st (decent complement to Murray/White)? Maybe IND would give up Turner (but they are already paying Brogdon & Oladipo a lot)? Maybe TOR would give up Anunoby (but that cuts into their 2021 cap space which I think they are reserving for Giannis)?


2020-21 Opening Day Roster

PG - Fox / Joseph
SG - Hood / James
SF - Ariza
PF - Gabriel / Ojeleye
C - Towns / Dedmon / Poirer

We'd have $23.0-39.2 mil in cap space in the 2020 offseason & $33.1-53.6 mil in cap space in the 2021 offseason (if we don't use any of it in the 2020 offseason). You'd just have to hope on adding signing a 3rd star to play with Fox & Towns (B. Ingram or A. Davis in the 2020 offseason or Giannis, K. Leonard, P. George, Oladipo, D. Mitchell, Tatum, J. Collins, Markkanen, or J. Isaac in the 2021 offseason)



Again, there's no way this is happening...

 

[jellyfish]

The Kings just need to make a mega offer like Buddy/Barnes/Bagley/filler for KAT/Covington/whatever makes it work throw it a protected top 5 1st as well if needed. Good to see you posting trade ideas I enjoy them.

 

[jellyfish]

I ignored it when NYK was monitoring him but now GSW I’d keep an eye in Towns now too.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...-warriors-monitoring-t-wolves-stars-situation

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/256639/Warriors-Monitoring-Karl-Anthony-Towns

Offer Fox/Bagley/Buddy our lottery pick this year than our 1st next year unprotected for KAT and Covington

Would swap out Fox with Barnes I think that's a bit much to give up if you include Fox take out the lottery pick, KAT on paper should be a good fit next to Fox.

Fox
Bogi
Covington
Holmes/Bjelica/Gilles
KAT/Holmes/GIles

Is a playoff team imo

 

[ESP47]

I think we would have to gut the team so much that we would wind up in a similar scenario to what we had with Cousins. A player or two that can put up numbers and a shell of a roster around them.

To me, KAT doesn't move the needle enough to gut the team because he doesn't play very good defense. I can live with a highly skilled offensive player at any position other than the 5 but it's very hard to win with a 5 that can't play defense. Right now, I think Jokic is the only one but he's a bit of a unicorn himself with his passing skills that make up for his bad defense.

 

[jellyfish]

I think we would have to gut the team so much that we would wind up in a similar scenario to what we had with Cousins. A player or two that can put up numbers and a shell of a roster around them.

To me, KAT doesn't move the needle enough to gut the team because he doesn't play very good defense. I can live with a highly skilled offensive player at any position other than the 5 but it's very hard to win with a 5 that can't play defense. Right now, I think Jokic is the only one but he's a bit of a unicorn himself with his passing skills that make up for his bad defense.

Other than Fox the team is worth gutting completely for a KAT type player, losing Barnes/Buddy is really nothing easy to replace, Bogi (they can have Bogi expiring as well if they want) could take over for Buddy and Covington can do what Barnes does on half the contract price. Bagley......yawn. Obviously the pick could be a big risk if it turns into a beastly player.

If the Kings keep Luke the way he utilizes Bjelica/Giles well in the half court image replacing that with KAT as a #1 option.
Fox, Bogi/?,Covington/Holmes/KAT is the best starting 5 the Kings would have put out since they made the playoffs.

 

[Section 101]

WTF, KAT is so overrated. Doesn't make his teammates better, doesn't command a double team. Softer than charmin.

 

[ESP47]

Other than Fox the team is worth gutting completely for a KAT type player, losing Barnes/Buddy is really nothing easy to replace, Bogi (they can have Bogi expiring as well if they want) could take over for Buddy and Covington can do what Barnes does on half the contract price. Bagley......yawn. Obviously the pick could be a big risk if it turns into a beastly player.

If the Kings keep Luke the way he utilizes Bjelica/Giles well in the half court image replacing that with KAT as a #1 option.
Fox, Bogi/?,Covington/Holmes/KAT is the best starting 5 the Kings would have put out since they made the playoffs.

I still don't see that as a playoff squad. Kind of resembles IT/Gay/Cousins.

KAT doesn't have the impact that a similar player in Embiid has because he doesn't play defense. The 76ers are a completely different team when Embiid is on the court. The Wolves suck whether KAT is playing or not. There's a reason why Jimmy Butler didn't like playing with him and it's because he's not a winner. He's better than Bagley for sure and is kind of best case scenario for Bagley but to me it's not enough and it's almost impossible to win with a poor defensive 5.

 

[jellyfish]

I still don't see that as a playoff squad. Kind of resembles IT/Gay/Cousins.

KAT doesn't have the impact that a similar player in Embiid has because he doesn't play defense. The 76ers are a completely different team when Embiid is on the court. The Wolves suck whether KAT is playing or not. There's a reason why Jimmy Butler didn't like playing with him and it's because he's not a winner. He's better than Bagley for sure and is kind of best case scenario for Bagley but to me it's not enough and it's almost impossible to win with a poor defensive 5.

To me if we can get rid of Buddy/Barnes contracts (neither are "winners")it's worth it but you are right in a lot of ways. I still think the starting 5 of Fox/Bogi/Holmes/KAT/Covington is a better fit/spacing than IT/Gay/Cousins/JT?/Thornton? (can't even remember) not even factoring basketball IQ which is in a massive favour to the newer squad, also defensively Covington/Holmes is better than anyone on that previous squad.

I don't see why Bjelica can play the 4 on defense (with ok success nothing spectacular or terrible) but KAT can't.

 

[bajaden]

Honestly, the only way we should trade for him is if we can keep Fox and I find that very, very hard to believe that we have the assets to pull that off (unless we win the lottery this year). Otherwise, we're just gutting our roster and won't have anyone around Towns.

2019-20 Trade Deadline

Trade #1
POR Gets: Harrison Barnes & Bogdan Bogdanovic
POR Gives: Kent Bazemore, Rodney Hood, Nassir Little, & 2020 POR 1st (Top 10 Protected)

SAC Gets: Kent Bazemore, Rodney Hood, Nassir Little, & 2020 POR 1st (Top 10 Protected)
SAC Gives: Harrison Barnes & Bogdan Bogdanovic

Trade #2
BOS Gets: Richaun Holmes & Nemanja Bjelica
BOS Gives: Vincent Porier, Romeo Langford, Semi Ojeleye, & 2020 BOS 1st (Top 10 Protected)

SAC Gets: Vincent Porier, Romeo Langford, Semi Ojeleye, & 2020 BOS 1st (Top 10 Protected)
SAC Gives: Richaun Holmes & Nemanja Bjelica


2020 Offseason

Trade #3
MIN Gets: Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley, Nassir Little, Romeo Langford, 2020 SAC 1st, 2020 POR 1st, 2020 BOS 1st, 2022 SAC 1st (unprotected), 2024 SAC 1st (unprotected)
MIN Gives: Karl Anthony-Towns

SAC Gets: Karl Anthony-Towns
SAC Gives: Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley, Nassir Little, Romeo Langford, 2020 SAC 1st, 2020 POR 1st, 2020 BOS 1st, 2022 SAC 1st (unprotected), 2024 SAC 1st (unprotected)

I can't find a trade that sends Hield to a 3rd team for a young asset. Maybe the Spurs would want him for their 1st (decent complement to Murray/White)? Maybe IND would give up Turner (but they are already paying Brogdon & Oladipo a lot)? Maybe TOR would give up Anunoby (but that cuts into their 2021 cap space which I think they are reserving for Giannis)?


2020-21 Opening Day Roster

PG - Fox / Joseph
SG - Hood / James
SF - Ariza
PF - Gabriel / Ojeleye
C - Towns / Dedmon / Poirer

We'd have $23.0-39.2 mil in cap space in the 2020 offseason & $33.1-53.6 mil in cap space in the 2021 offseason (if we don't use any of it in the 2020 offseason). You'd just have to hope on adding signing a 3rd star to play with Fox & Towns (B. Ingram or A. Davis in the 2020 offseason or Giannis, K. Leonard, P. George, Oladipo, D. Mitchell, Tatum, J. Collins, Markkanen, or J. Isaac in the 2021 offseason)



Again, there's no way this is happening...

I didn't even look at the trades you proposed, and for a simple reason. Almost every trade you propose has three or four teams involved. It's nearly impossible to get a trade done between two teams, much less 3 or 4. I appreciate the work you put in making everything match etc. but the simpler you can make it, the better the chance of if actually happening.

 

[bajaden]

WTF, KAT is so overrated. Doesn't make his teammates better, doesn't command a double team. Softer than charmin.

Ahem, KAT is averaging 26.5 ppg on 51.4% shooting overall, while shooting 41.8% from the three, while taking 8.5 three's a game. He's also averaging 11.7 rebounds, 4.4 assists, 1 steal, and 1.3 blocked shots a game. He can come and be soft on my team anytime he wants. Of course it's not going to happen, but it would fun to watch both he and Fox on the floor together.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

We are headed for a big roster shakeup, on present course, and unless Giannis turns down his extension, KAT is about the best we can do.

 

[bajaden]

I still don't see that as a playoff squad. Kind of resembles IT/Gay/Cousins.

KAT doesn't have the impact that a similar player in Embiid has because he doesn't play defense. The 76ers are a completely different team when Embiid is on the court. The Wolves suck whether KAT is playing or not. There's a reason why Jimmy Butler didn't like playing with him and it's because he's not a winner. He's better than Bagley for sure and is kind of best case scenario for Bagley but to me it's not enough and it's almost impossible to win with a poor defensive 5.

KAT's ortg is 123 while his drtg is 107. That's a plus differential of +16

Embiid's ortg is 115 while his drtg is 101. That's a plus differential of +14

The 107 is not great, but it's not terrible either, and his offense actually makes up for some of his defense. I don't put a lot of stock in plus/minus period because too much of the stat depends on who is on the floor with you. Take Wiggins off the floor and replace him with Butler, and KAT's defensive rating will come down. As far as on court/off court goes, Embiid has a differential of +5.1, while KAT has a differential of +9.0.

Several years ago when Harden was coming off the bench for the Thunder, and rumors were that they were looking to move him, I posted on the forum that I thought the Kings should go after him. I got the same dam argument about Harden. He was a terrible defender, and as Bricky said at the time, he was nothing but a chucker. Well, wouldn't everyong love to have Harden on our team now? KAT is a very good basketball player, and I would take him in a heartbeat. But not at the expense of losing Fox.

 

[twslam07]

I didn't even look at the trades you proposed, and for a simple reason. Almost every trade you propose has three or four teams involved. It's nearly impossible to get a trade done between two teams, much less 3 or 4. I appreciate the work you put in making everything match etc. but the simpler you can make it, the better the chance of if actually happening.

You should try reading my post. I basically said there’s no chance this will happen.

Kings are not good trade partners with the Wolves. The only way to make it work would be to send Hield, Bogdan, Barnes, Bjelica, & Holmes for picks/young assets and send those young assets to MIN (since a rebuilding MIN would have no interest in players of that age). That’s a lot of players needing to be on the move which really makes this whole KAT pipe dream DOA.

 

[jellyfish]

Maybe I would be willing to part with Fox, the PG position has the most talent by a long way you can always get a serviceable PG no matter what (unless Vlade is GM). It's much harder to find elite bigs who can shoot or wing players that are amazing.

 

[Tetsujin]

Hating on Boogie for putting up numbers on a bad team but also wanting to trade everyone for KAT, who's pretty much doing what Boogie did only with the intensity of unflavored oatmeal, is how this team has stayed bad for 17 years.

 

[ESP47]

KAT's ortg is 123 while his drtg is 107. That's a plus differential of +16

Embiid's ortg is 115 while his drtg is 101. That's a plus differential of +14

The 107 is not great, but it's not terrible either, and his offense actually makes up for some of his defense. I don't put a lot of stock in plus/minus period because too much of the stat depends on who is on the floor with you. Take Wiggins off the floor and replace him with Butler, and KAT's defensive rating will come down. As far as on court/off court goes, Embiid has a differential of +5.1, while KAT has a differential of +9.0.

Several years ago when Harden was coming off the bench for the Thunder, and rumors were that they were looking to move him, I posted on the forum that I thought the Kings should go after him. I got the same dam argument about Harden. He was a terrible defender, and as Bricky said at the time, he was nothing but a chucker. Well, wouldn't everyong love to have Harden on our team now? KAT is a very good basketball player, and I would take him in a heartbeat. But not at the expense of losing Fox.

If KAT was a triple double threat every night and made his teammates better, I'd do it in a heartbeat. If we were talking Jokic here, I would more than gladly have him as a poor defending 5 on this team because he brings the passing aspect to the game. KAT is a decent passer but there's a big difference in being a solid passer and being a guy that you can run the entire offense through. To me, that's the difference in these players that don't play defense, but they still lead their team to victories. It's why Harden, Doncic and Jokic can lead their teams. You take away that quarterback aspect of their games and they will lead their teams to about as many wins as the Wolves get every year.

 

[Section 101]

Ahem, KAT is averaging 26.5 ppg on 51.4% shooting overall, while shooting 41.8% from the three, while taking 8.5 three's a game. He's also averaging 11.7 rebounds, 4.4 assists, 1 steal, and 1.3 blocked shots a game. He can come and be soft on my team anytime he wants. Of course it's not going to happen, but it would fun to watch both he and Fox on the floor together.

I didn't say he was a bad player. He's not the guy you give up the house to get.

He's not a number 1 option alpha dog. He's barely made the all start team twice (Hint: Cousins got hurt). His teams win/loss record is 136-185.

 

[ockingsfan]

I ignored it when NYK was monitoring him but now GSW I’d keep an eye in Towns now too.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...-warriors-monitoring-t-wolves-stars-situation

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/256639/Warriors-Monitoring-Karl-Anthony-Towns

Offer Fox/Bagley/Buddy our lottery pick this year than our 1st next year unprotected for KAT and Covington

I wouldn't offer Fox in the deal for KAT. You still need a point guard to go along with KAT.

I would offer Bagley, Buddy, and salary filler (Ariza or Dedmon) and a 1st round pick for KAT. That is a pretty good haul for the Wolves. I would also take a salary dump contract (not named Wiggins) off their hands too.

This would be a starting lineup that could compete for the playoffs:

PF Holmes
SF Barnes
C KAT
SG Bogdan
PG Fox

 

[NewArena]

Maybe I would be willing to part with Fox, the PG position has the most talent by a long way you can always get a serviceable PG no matter what (unless Vlade is GM). It's much harder to find elite bigs who can shoot or wing players that are amazing.

lmao what? how's that working out for Minnesota?

 

[NewArena]

I wouldn't offer Fox in the deal for KAT.

Period. wtf am i reading in here

 

[Booster]

Ask yourself ...why would KAT want to be here long term. Plus we would have to rebuild again.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Well, wouldn't everyong love to have Harden on our team now?

Um, no. Not everyone. Don’t care what his stats are, he can be part of 50+ game winners (largely built on BS officiating treatment he gets) elsewhere. He’s the type of player I’d never want to watch play on the team I root for.

That said, I do understand and agree with the crux of your post, specifically pertaining to KAT.

 

[Section 101]

Maybe I would be willing to part with Fox, the PG position has the most talent by a long way you can always get a serviceable PG no matter what (unless Vlade is GM). It's much harder to find elite bigs who can shoot or wing players that are amazing.

100% wrong. PG is the hardest position to fill. The difference in PG play is huge in talent. Look at the drop off between Fox and Joseph/Yogi. And elite bigs don't have the impact they once did with all the rule changes. You need a big who can shoot and pass to go along with the post play. If they can only do one then they get taken out in the playoffs.

 

[VF21]

Period. wtf am i reading in here

The KF version of Virtual GM?

 

[jellyfish]

100% wrong. PG is the hardest position to fill. The difference in PG play is huge in talent. Look at the drop off between Fox and Joseph/Yogi. And elite bigs don't have the impact they once did with all the rule changes. You need a big who can shoot and pass to go along with the post play. If they can only do one then they get taken out in the playoffs.

The Kings were fine (actually the best they have played all season) with Cojo/Yogi despite them being crap PGs, PG has the most talent of any posiiton (since most the people on the planet are a PG's size) and is the easiest to fill with a starting level player. The drop off in talent between Fox/Cojo is huge but the drop off in team winning has been equally huge with Fox back (not saying it's his fault he won us the game vs Grizz).

You can get quality starting PG's for under 12mil per season (once their rookie contract runs out), we had Darren Collison who was super solid just as one example you also got guys like Rubio (who I think the Jazz are wishing they still had), Hawks Teague, Schroder (playing excellent for the above 500. OKC), Spencer Dimwiddie (been beasting at only 10 mil per) Elfriad Payton (8mil), Van Fleet , Sato it's really easy to find a quality PG who is not a star but can hold their own. Than also you got rookie contract guys like Aaron Holiday who has good potential and has played well as a starter, Nunn, Monte Morris, Lonzo. There is never a lack of starting level talent at the PG spot.

 

[Artur91]

None of the trades will work. This team don’t have enoght talent to make it to the PO. And if u want to get KAT or Simmons u need to give something in exchange. Best way to rebuild is getting the right picks in next couple years first rounders then let’s see what we can do

 

[Sactown ExPat]

What’s interesting to me is, despite the cacophony about our “wasted” picks across multiple front office iterations, some of the loudest would still rather get even more picks rather than trade 2-3 future picks for a KAT, Benny, Embiid, etc. I mean, we’re going to waste them anyway, right? Might as well spend them on a guaranteed superstar. The top 3 teams in the West all spent at least three future 1st round picks putting their teams together.