Grades/post-game discussion v. Raptors - 12/10

VF21

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#1
We lost. Life will go on.

At least it was over early and we still have most of the afternoon.

If you don't play to win, you won't win. It's that simple.
 
#5
To paraphrase the reporter asked him about Jakaar's recent play and if and how Joeger plans on fitting him as a piece into the puzzle. Joeger responded with something along the lines of "Probably not, not to be blunt"....."We plan to have Willie back soon, Jakaars been playing great, but a player that runs around the way he does with his energy and size tends to make up for not knowing whats going on on the court".

Nothing he said was necessarily false but personally I put a lot of stock into having energy as a player, and our team LACKS that for long stretches. Every team needs an energy guy.
 
#6
To paraphrase the reporter asked him about Jakaar's recent play and if and how Joeger plans on fitting him as a piece into the puzzle. Joeger responded with something along the lines of "Probably not, not to be blunt"....."We plan to have Willie back soon, Jakaars been playing great, but a player that runs around the way he does with his energy and size tends to make up for not knowing whats going on on the court".

Nothing he said was necessarily false but personally I put a lot of stock into having energy as a player, and our team LACKS that for long stretches. Every team needs an energy guy.
I rewinded back, Joerger also said something along the lines of that the Kings have long-term young players that they need to actually give playing time so they can develop. He was implying that there's not a lot of room for a journey man on this team full of 1st and 2nd year players that need PT.

I completely understand where he's coming from... but it was a little harsh. Sampson brings more effort on the court than any of our players aside from ZBo.
 
#8
Yes Joerger hates energy, he likes it snail pace so he understands what's going on.

What he said about Sampson isn't very professional regardless if true. Why play after you hear that?
 
#9
To paraphrase the reporter asked him about Jakaar's recent play and if and how Joeger plans on fitting him as a piece into the puzzle. Joeger responded with something along the lines of "Probably not, not to be blunt"....."We plan to have Willie back soon, Jakaars been playing great, but a player that runs around the way he does with his energy and size tends to make up for not knowing whats going on on the court".

Nothing he said was necessarily false but personally I put a lot of stock into having energy as a player, and our team LACKS that for long stretches. Every team needs an energy guy.
Just heard it and wasn’t that bad... basically they have lots of guys who they have to play. Willie will take time and Jakar isn’t on a long term deal. Praised his effort and said effort can make up for lack of other things.
 
#10
My issue is the ball movement is so much better on the second team then when the first team is on the floor.

Both ZBo and Fox hold the ball way longer and don’t pass the ball until their clear they don’t have a shot. This ball stopping causes contested shots instead of open shots that you see with the second team. Starters have 5 assists and the bench has 10.
 
#11
I still don't even get why Joerger is an NBA coach. Inherited a great team and gets to live off that success since. I don't know any coach that talks down on its players like that.
 
#12
I still don't even get why Joerger is an NBA coach. Inherited a great team and gets to live off that success since. I don't know any coach that talks down on its players like that.
You hear what you want to hear. Players play hard for Joerger....no one has ever disputed that. If he talked down on his players, they wouldn't play hard. He's not George Karl.
 
#13
You hear what you want to hear. Players play hard for Joerger....no one has ever disputed that. If he talked down on his players, they wouldn't play hard. He's not George Karl.
If I was Sampson and heard those comments my motivation would be pretty shot. I don't get how you can really defend it, it's a crapty thing to say to a player playing hard for us right now.
Also discouraging energy players is classic Joerger.
 
#16
If I was Sampson and heard those comments my motivation would be pretty shot. I don't get how you can really defend it, it's a poopooty thing to say to a player playing hard for us right now.
Also discouraging energy players is classic Joerger.
I agree with you on the Zach comments but I think your being unfair in this instance.

1) Jakar is on a 10 day contract and Dave is appropriately not blowing smoke up his butt.

2) He praised his hustle and said it can overcome a lot of other deficiencies.
 
#17
You hear what you want to hear. Players play hard for Joerger....no one has ever disputed that. If he talked down on his players, they wouldn't play hard. He's not George Karl.

I don't know if Joerger should be in the same sentence as Karl. Karl won everywhere, except Sac. The verdict is out on whether Joerger is a good coach. He took over a Memphis team loaded with borderline All Stars that was already winning. He's never built anything from the ground up. Karl was a terrible playoff coach. But, has coached many HOF'ers from a young age.
 
#18
I don't know if Joerger should be in the same sentence as Karl. Karl won everywhere, except Sac. The verdict is out on whether Joerger is a good coach. He took over a Memphis team loaded with borderline All Stars that was already winning. He's never built anything from the ground up. Karl was a terrible playoff coach. But, has coached many HOF'ers from a young age.
What about the year with the injuries in Memphis? That doesn't count? Anyways, the point was his comments were not that bad. Just my opinion.
 

VF21

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#19
Yes Joerger hates energy, he likes it snail pace so he understands what's going on.

What he said about Sampson isn't very professional regardless if true. Why play after you hear that?
First, your snipes at Joerger are beyond ridiculous. He has been trying to get the team to play at a faster pace, to the point of SCREAMING "RUN" at the top of his voice so much he is hoarse by the end of the night.

About Sampson? Oh please. These aren't grade school prima donas. These are grown-ass professional basketball players. JaKarr Sampson and anyone else will play because that's what they're being paid to do. You're actually insulting anybody in a jersey with a comment like that, not your intended target.

I simply cannot understand the fascination some of you have with micro-analyzing every single word that comes out of Coach Joerger's mouth as though they're carved on stone. You guys were way off base thinking Joerger was insulting Kayte, and you're way off base now. Do you want him to speak all sunshine and lollipops after a loss? If he did, you'd be all over him about not being tough enough, not understanding how to coach players, etc.

We lost. We lost for a lot of reasons, including the irrefutable fact that we're not a good team...yet. We did NOT lose or will not lose because Dave Joerger told it like it is about a player on a two-way contract from the D league, regardless of how good said player might have played during a game or two on the road in December 2017. I guarantee it.
 

VF21

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#20
I don't know if Joerger should be in the same sentence as Karl. Karl won everywhere, except Sac. The verdict is out on whether Joerger is a good coach. He took over a Memphis team loaded with borderline All Stars that was already winning. He's never built anything from the ground up. Karl was a terrible playoff coach. But, has coached many HOF'ers from a young age.
George Karl also got fired his last job before Sacramento. And he got old. And he got tired.

It's funny but the vast majority of those who think the jury is out on whether or not Joerger is a good coach seem to be a handful of disgruntled Kings fans.
 

VF21

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#21
I agree with you on the Zach comments but I think your being unfair in this instance.

1) Jakar is on a 10 day contract and Dave is appropriately not blowing smoke up his butt.

2) He praised his hustle and said it can overcome a lot of other deficiencies.
Not to pick nits, because I agree with the substance of your post, but JaKarr Sampson is not on a 10-day contract. He's on a two-way contract. Small but possibly significant difference. :)
 

VF21

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#22
If I was Sampson and heard those comments my motivation would be pretty shot. I don't get how you can really defend it, it's a poopooty thing to say to a player playing hard for us right now.
Also discouraging energy players is classic Joerger.
You're actually starting to approach the city limits of Trollville.
 
#23
Joerger is using Sampson exactly what he was signed to a two-way contract for, basically as a filler for when a front court player is unavailable for whatever reason. Sampson’s time with the big club is limited to 45 days (not 45 games, 45 days). Sampson is getting exactly what he signed on for (maybe more). During his time with the big club, he is getting to practice with an NBA team and has access to all the resources that an NBA team provides. Because of the King’ circumstances, he is getting actual game time experience and NBA exposure which is actually like auditioning for NBA teams and could lead to an NBA contract in the future.

However, Joerger was just being honest (bluntly) that he cannot work him into the full-time rotation. That would takeaway minutes from the players being developed and would use up Sampson’s limited NBA contract time.

Joerger praised his effort and said effort can make up for other short comings. Joerger has no control over the roster, that is a front office decision. The only way the Kings can offer him a full-time contract is reduce the current roster by one. Who would you cut and eat their contract?

I like Sampson and wish him success. He’s an easy guy to root for. He is getting an opportunity to shine. Sampson has been around for a while. He was undrafted in the 2014 draft and was eventually signed by the 76ers who waived him in February 2016. He then signed with the Nuggets but was waived in October. He has played in a total of 152 NBA games. He could be a high energy end of the bench guy, but I can’t see sacrificing the minutes of the players the Kings are trying to develop to give them to him.
 
#24
I will give Joerger props for getting this team to play hard on most nights. Randolph's influence has been huge on the morale of this team. Not exactly the best situation for obtaining a Top 5 pick next year. Kings would only have 2-3 wins without Randolph's play.
 
#25
You're actually starting to approach the city limits of Trollville.
Vladizzle is bringing up perfectly valid points. They just happen to go completely against what you believe. He is far from being a troll. Not liking a coach does not make him a troll. Come on now.
To a t the gripes I've read here are some of the same gripes grizz fans at their forums were complaining about the day he came here. I'm not sold on the guy either. Does that make me some ingrate or troll too?

What is it joeger said earlier in the season? I want to see the players who want to play. What a crock. Sampson is playing his a$$ off. I don't care that he's not in our long term plans. Neither are most of the veterans on our team. So what's the point? I want to see the guy play cause he busts his a$$.
 
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#26
Toronto is the type of team that will have their way with us, I give the guys credit for keeping it close despite the abysmal start. Raptor starters are all battle tested veterans in their prime, they won't make many mistakes and will just execute, execute, execute until all your own mistakes add up and it's too late. I like Bogi being moved to starting SG. Will be interesting to see if Joerger sticks with Hill there going forward.
 
#27
First, your snipes at Joerger are beyond ridiculous. He has been trying to get the team to play at a faster pace, to the point of SCREAMING "RUN" at the top of his voice so much he is hoarse by the end of the night.

About Sampson? Oh please. These aren't grade school prima donas. These are grown-ass professional basketball players. JaKarr Sampson and anyone else will play because that's what they're being paid to do. You're actually insulting anybody in a jersey with a comment like that, not your intended target.

I simply cannot understand the fascination some of you have with micro-analyzing every single word that comes out of Coach Joerger's mouth as though they're carved on stone. You guys were way off base thinking Joerger was insulting Kayte, and you're way off base now. Do you want him to speak all sunshine and lollipops after a loss? If he did, you'd be all over him about not being tough enough, not understanding how to coach players, etc.

We lost. We lost for a lot of reasons, including the irrefutable fact that we're not a good team...yet. We did NOT lose or will not lose because Dave Joerger told it like it is about a player on a two-way contract from the D league, regardless of how good said player might have played during a game or two on the road in December 2017. I guarantee it.
Weren't you singing Jakarr Sampson's praises just a few days ago after the Cavs game and propping him up as more than the fringe NBA player than he is and Joerger called him? Now all of a sudden he's telling it like it is.

It's interesting that this happened considering there's a desire to defend Vlade or Joerger's every action here and a propensity for love affairs with these hustle players like Sampson.

It is very Karl-esque. I don't particularly care because everything he said about Sampson is right, but everyone (rightfully) bought into the idea that Karl was an awful coach here. Everyone would be screaming their heads off about comments Karl made about certain players (Seth Curry/WCS ring a bell) and this really isn't that different.
 

VF21

#KingsFansForever
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#28
Vladizzle is bringing up perfectly valid points. They just happen to go completely against what you believe. He is far from being a troll. Not liking a coach does not make him a troll. Come on now.
To a t the gripes I've read here are some of the same gripes grizz fans at their forums were complaining about the day he came here. I'm not sold on the guy either. Does that make me some ingrate or troll too?
No, you're not an ingrate or a troll. Neither is Vladizzle ... yet.

You think he has a good point about Joerger discouraging energy players? Please elaborate. You think Joerger hurt Sampson's feelings and now he's not gonna play hard? Seriously?

I think Vladizzle is unable to contain his hatred of all things Dave Joerger. Sometimes it just gets to be a bit overwhelming. That's why I said "approaching the city limits"...
 

VF21

#KingsFansForever
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#29
Weren't you singing Jakarr Sampson's praises just a few days ago after the Cavs game and propping him up as more than the fringe NBA player than he is and Joerger called him? Now all of a sudden he's telling it like it is.

It's interesting that this happened considering there's a desire to defend Vlade or Joerger's every action here and a propensity for love affairs with these hustle players like Sampson.

It is very Karl-esque. I don't particularly care because everything he said about Sampson is right, but everyone (rightfully) bought into the idea that Karl was an awful coach here. Everyone would be screaming their heads off about comments Karl made about certain players (Seth Curry/WCS ring a bell) and this really isn't that different.
Yes, I did sing JaKarr Sampson's praises. On those two nights he was a bright spot on the horizon when we needed one. That doesn't change the truth, that although I liked what I saw, it's most likely not in the future cards for the Kings. He's only there because WCS isn't.

Other than that, you say po-tay-to, I say meh.

:)
 

VF21

#KingsFansForever
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#30
Toronto is the type of team that will have their way with us, I give the guys credit for keeping it close despite the abysmal start. Raptor starters are all battle tested veterans in their prime, they won't make many mistakes and will just execute, execute, execute until all your own mistakes add up and it's too late. I like Bogi being moved to starting SG. Will be interesting to see if Joerger sticks with Hill there going forward.
To me, what's interesting/concerning is that George Hill was gone once again for personal reasons. I'm curious to know if the team knows what they are, and if there will come a time when they take him out of the normal rotation because of it. I cannot recall another time when a starting player missed so many games because of non-game issues.