2022 Everything Free Agency/Trades Thread
- Thread starter The_Jamal
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@Capt. Factorial
I'm not sure how the sign extension and trade works, do you know?
I've thought that Barnes and Holmes for Wiggins makes a ton of sense for both sides. Barnes is a downgrade at this point for sure, but his ending salary saves the Warriors a boatload for next year and Holmes in the PNR with Curry and replaces the loss of Looney. This also allows them to bring Wiseman along slowly and opens up minutes for Moody and Kuminga.
I'm not sure how the sign extension and trade works, do you know?
I've thought that Barnes and Holmes for Wiggins makes a ton of sense for both sides. Barnes is a downgrade at this point for sure, but his ending salary saves the Warriors a boatload for next year and Holmes in the PNR with Curry and replaces the loss of Looney. This also allows them to bring Wiseman along slowly and opens up minutes for Moody and Kuminga.
While I'm inclined to believe that Wiggins probably wouldn't be all-star material when divorced from the Warriors' sorcery, the Mike Brown connection does matter, especially since Wiggins is a pretty good defender on the wing, which remains the quality that the Kings most need to find at the SF position.
Fox
Huerter
Wiggins
Murray
Sabonis
I'm not ready to say that I'd be willing to take on whatever contract extension Wiggins is likely to command, but that's a starting unit with a ton of weapons and a ton of versatility, and if Brown can get such a team playing even top-20 defense, it's very likely a playoff team with some legs under it and quite a bit of room to grow.
Fox
Huerter
Wiggins
Murray
Sabonis
I'm not ready to say that I'd be willing to take on whatever contract extension Wiggins is likely to command, but that's a starting unit with a ton of weapons and a ton of versatility, and if Brown can get such a team playing even top-20 defense, it's very likely a playoff team with some legs under it and quite a bit of room to grow.
What we've seen with Wiggins in Golden State is essentially just the opposite of what happened with Harrison Barnes when he signed in Dallas.
Wiggins wasn't cut out to be a #1 option. Despite his athleticism he doesn't have a quick first step or a good handle and struggled to create offense on his own. But that's what the Wolves asked him to do and so he did, but at relatively inefficient rates. When he got to Golden State they asked him to play a much smaller role - hit open shots, move the ball and play defense. That last one is the only real surprise. Wiggins was a terrible defender in Minnesota and has become a very good one with the Warriors. Likely a combination of less effort needed on offense and the scheme/culture/coaching in GS.
Barnes didn't really get too much less efficient in Dallas, but we saw the limit of what he was capable of. He was asked to be a #1 option, and it just didn't really suit his skills or game. As a result he posted some of the lowest eFG% years of his career outside of his first two seasons and dipped a bit on the defensive end as well.
As long as Wiggin's next team (assuming he's moved) has a strong defensive culture and asks him to be more of a role player I don't think we'll see any drops in his production. Maybe slightly lower shooting numbers without the gravity of Steph and Klay giving him wide open looks. We'll see.
Wiggins wasn't cut out to be a #1 option. Despite his athleticism he doesn't have a quick first step or a good handle and struggled to create offense on his own. But that's what the Wolves asked him to do and so he did, but at relatively inefficient rates. When he got to Golden State they asked him to play a much smaller role - hit open shots, move the ball and play defense. That last one is the only real surprise. Wiggins was a terrible defender in Minnesota and has become a very good one with the Warriors. Likely a combination of less effort needed on offense and the scheme/culture/coaching in GS.
Barnes didn't really get too much less efficient in Dallas, but we saw the limit of what he was capable of. He was asked to be a #1 option, and it just didn't really suit his skills or game. As a result he posted some of the lowest eFG% years of his career outside of his first two seasons and dipped a bit on the defensive end as well.
As long as Wiggin's next team (assuming he's moved) has a strong defensive culture and asks him to be more of a role player I don't think we'll see any drops in his production. Maybe slightly lower shooting numbers without the gravity of Steph and Klay giving him wide open looks. We'll see.
Its an interesting lineup, and I think we routinely undersell the value of a defensive coach/system that makes sense. There are a lot of good defenses made up of mostly average defenders where the sum is greater than the parts.
Our own glory day kings were a good example. Only two rotation guys (Christie and BJax) were plus defenders. They were mostly average/professional defenders (guys who were some combination of decently athletic/long/hardnosed and could defend if they wanted to, like Webber, Pollard, Jimmy Jackson, and Hedo) or team defenders (guys who weren't terribly athletic or hard nosed, but were smart enough to defend in a team system like Vlade, Peja, Fundy, and if we are being generous Bibby).
So if you could get Brown to develop a good system, build trust, and get guys to buy in, why not? Ideally, you add on more plus defenders, giving you Mitchell and someone like Wiggins. But even if you can't do that, I don't think you are that far away from a competent defense if you have a good system, you get guys to buy in and you hold them accountable.
In addition to Mitchell you have some "professional/average defenders" who have some length, athleticism, or dog, that can be harnessed by a good system. Guys like Holmes, Barnes, Murray, Fox, Davis, Monk, Lyles, Metu could all be average defenders who contribute to a system, similar to Webber and those guys). And the remaining guys - Sabonis and Huerter - seem like high BBIQ guys who can at least approximate what Vlade, Bibby, and Peja brought to the table. So I think there are some tools to develop an average defense, if you trust in Brown.
Our own glory day kings were a good example. Only two rotation guys (Christie and BJax) were plus defenders. They were mostly average/professional defenders (guys who were some combination of decently athletic/long/hardnosed and could defend if they wanted to, like Webber, Pollard, Jimmy Jackson, and Hedo) or team defenders (guys who weren't terribly athletic or hard nosed, but were smart enough to defend in a team system like Vlade, Peja, Fundy, and if we are being generous Bibby).
So if you could get Brown to develop a good system, build trust, and get guys to buy in, why not? Ideally, you add on more plus defenders, giving you Mitchell and someone like Wiggins. But even if you can't do that, I don't think you are that far away from a competent defense if you have a good system, you get guys to buy in and you hold them accountable.
In addition to Mitchell you have some "professional/average defenders" who have some length, athleticism, or dog, that can be harnessed by a good system. Guys like Holmes, Barnes, Murray, Fox, Davis, Monk, Lyles, Metu could all be average defenders who contribute to a system, similar to Webber and those guys). And the remaining guys - Sabonis and Huerter - seem like high BBIQ guys who can at least approximate what Vlade, Bibby, and Peja brought to the table. So I think there are some tools to develop an average defense, if you trust in Brown.
Hm. Interesting. Wiggins at 4/100 feels like a bold and very "win now" kind of move. It says "all-in" on Fox/Sabonis, because Wiggins seems most effective in a 3rd option kind of role. It says "all-in" on Mike Brown, because you're hoping he continues to bring the best out of Wiggins' defensive ability. And it says "all-in" on this roster as a playoff contender, because the money's all spent at that point.
It's quite a gamble, but if you're counting on Wiggins being an off-ball, 3-and-D maestro and athletic running mate alongside Fox in the fast break, I think it could work, expensive though it would be to fill that starting SF position. Ultimately, I think I'd rather take a swing with Wiggins at 27 and 4/100 over Barnes at 30 and 4/80. Can't believe I'm saying that, but such is the hope that Wiggins' improvement is sustainable to at least some degree.
It's quite a gamble, but if you're counting on Wiggins being an off-ball, 3-and-D maestro and athletic running mate alongside Fox in the fast break, I think it could work, expensive though it would be to fill that starting SF position. Ultimately, I think I'd rather take a swing with Wiggins at 27 and 4/100 over Barnes at 30 and 4/80. Can't believe I'm saying that, but such is the hope that Wiggins' improvement is sustainable to at least some degree.
Actually, it looks like the CBAFAQ has pointed me wrong on one major point here. The "extend-and-trade" is disallowed following the LAST day of the final season of the contract (i.e. when the player is an impending free agent) but I see nothing in the CBA that suggests, like the CBAFAQ says, that an extend-and-trade is disallowed during the final season of the contract (so long as the regular season is not over). So it would appear Wiggins *is* eligible for an extend-and-trade.