should martin come off the bench
- Thread starter tyrant
- Start date
I think he should start, but i don't think he will need to play every minute of every game (he might not get injured as much either). He also won't be needed to put up 48 points just for us to win.
I hope by the time Kevin is ready to return, the team is still playing team ball and Kevin can just slide back in and be the efficient scorer he is. But the difference hopefully is that the rest of the team will be pulling their weight and Kevin can put more effort into other aspects of his game (i.e. defense, rebounding, etc..) which ultimately helps the team.
I hope by the time Kevin is ready to return, the team is still playing team ball and Kevin can just slide back in and be the efficient scorer he is. But the difference hopefully is that the rest of the team will be pulling their weight and Kevin can put more effort into other aspects of his game (i.e. defense, rebounding, etc..) which ultimately helps the team.
I am really unsure about Kevin's future role, so I think I'd have to pick "other."
I don't think he'd work at SF.
He could maybe work with Garcia at SF and Evans at PG, but Garcia's not great at SF (in most matchups) either. It might work well against small ball teams, but there aren't a lot of those.
Put Evans at PG, Martin at SG, and someone like Casspi at SF, and JT's going to have to be making those 6 assist games a real habit. And what happens when he needs a rest?
Trading Kevin is one of those things that has to be unpopular, because he's the face of the franchise, seems like a very nice guy, has been cool with trying to carry our generally awful team, and plays really hard (on offense) most of the time. Plus he seems like he really wants to stay in Sac. Even though it might be best for the team, I can understand how people are reluctant to espouse unloading him.
No matter what we do about Kevin, I think there's going to be some pain involved.
I don't think he'd work at SF.
He could maybe work with Garcia at SF and Evans at PG, but Garcia's not great at SF (in most matchups) either. It might work well against small ball teams, but there aren't a lot of those.
Put Evans at PG, Martin at SG, and someone like Casspi at SF, and JT's going to have to be making those 6 assist games a real habit. And what happens when he needs a rest?
Trading Kevin is one of those things that has to be unpopular, because he's the face of the franchise, seems like a very nice guy, has been cool with trying to carry our generally awful team, and plays really hard (on offense) most of the time. Plus he seems like he really wants to stay in Sac. Even though it might be best for the team, I can understand how people are reluctant to espouse unloading him.
No matter what we do about Kevin, I think there's going to be some pain involved.
My whole deal is coming to the realization of whether or not to move Martin.. That would come with starting him after he returns. Kind of like the Webber thing.. The team got worse and we all knew it was never going to work with him here anymore at that point. Could happen with Martin too. The good thing is though we have a 30ppg guy on the market plus an expiring in KT. If that doesn't get bites then I don't know what will.
A
its okay gary... its gonna be okay.
but we should only deal martin if we get a legit player to replace him. if petrie makes another impulse trade for more movable pieces he should be fired.
if we dont get a star to replace martin im done with this team until petrie is fired(not that i will be missed that much). because he has traded damn near every player that he has drafted since he's been here for garbage. with the exception of bibby of course...
but back to the topic at hand...
martin should start once he gets back, there is no question about it. before he got hurt he was playing his butt off and for the first time in his career carried this team on his back for a win and played hurt(unknowingly hurt)...
but we should only deal martin if we get a legit player to replace him. if petrie makes another impulse trade for more movable pieces he should be fired.
if we dont get a star to replace martin im done with this team until petrie is fired(not that i will be missed that much). because he has traded damn near every player that he has drafted since he's been here for garbage. with the exception of bibby of course...
but back to the topic at hand...
martin should start once he gets back, there is no question about it. before he got hurt he was playing his butt off and for the first time in his career carried this team on his back for a win and played hurt(unknowingly hurt)...
This is really tough to answer as I think it should be based upon how well the team is playing and how often they are winning in KHurt's 8 week absence.
If the team continues to win, and let's say they are .500 without KHurt it would be tough to put him right back into the starting line-up. If they are winning 60-65% of the games without Kevin then I think it becomes extremely difficult, even unwise, to "rock the boat." If they are only winning around 40% of their games then it is very feasible.
In the event the Kngs are winning 50% of the time and KHurt is immediately placed back into the starting line-up and we begin to lose often, start giving up 110-120 pts/game etc, "It" could really hit the fan.
I am going to vote "no" based on how we have played in the 3 games without him - which is pre-mature to say the least.
If the team continues to win, and let's say they are .500 without KHurt it would be tough to put him right back into the starting line-up. If they are winning 60-65% of the games without Kevin then I think it becomes extremely difficult, even unwise, to "rock the boat." If they are only winning around 40% of their games then it is very feasible.
In the event the Kngs are winning 50% of the time and KHurt is immediately placed back into the starting line-up and we begin to lose often, start giving up 110-120 pts/game etc, "It" could really hit the fan.
I am going to vote "no" based on how we have played in the 3 games without him - which is pre-mature to say the least.
We aren't going to go undefeated during the duration of his absence, if we did I think this would be a no-brainer. If we're playing any better than .400 ball (which is better than many predicted here for the full season) I say use the injury as an excuse to test him in a 6th man role and ease him back in. Throwing him right back into the fire could not only upset whatever chemistry was going on while he was out but diminish any future return should we choose to move him.
If Evans is the future and we believe that he is ready to be the man now, I think we should trade Martin. Obviously, it is too early to make any final conclusions but it seems like Martin is not the best partner for Evans. Evans is way more effective next to a player who can play both guard positions and Beno or Cisco are the guys for him. Beno makes Evans better and Tyreke does the same thing to Udrih.
Martin MUST Start... Here is why:
1. Martin > Beno
2. Martin draws defensive attention. Tyreke will also draw defensive attention. With both guys on the floor, more open looks and mismatches for both.
3. Plus, most teams have that one-lockdown defender... who will they put him on? A guy who scores 30 a night or a guy who scores 30 a night?
4. Makes for a FIERCE backcourt. Just fierce.
1. Martin > Beno
2. Martin draws defensive attention. Tyreke will also draw defensive attention. With both guys on the floor, more open looks and mismatches for both.
3. Plus, most teams have that one-lockdown defender... who will they put him on? A guy who scores 30 a night or a guy who scores 30 a night?
4. Makes for a FIERCE backcourt. Just fierce.
I agree. I don't know how anyone who KNOWS basketball thinks bringing the league's 3rd leading scorer off the bench is a good idea, especially with his recent commitment to defense.
I don't expect the potential trade talks involving Kev to stop since Tyreke could play sg. But the question should be do we trade Kev? Not do we bring him off the bench. But 8 games, 3 of which Kev hasn't played in, is way to early to tell if he will fit in with this group.
I don't expect the potential trade talks involving Kev to stop since Tyreke could play sg. But the question should be do we trade Kev? Not do we bring him off the bench. But 8 games, 3 of which Kev hasn't played in, is way to early to tell if he will fit in with this group.
The last 3 years are certainly not all on Martin. However, his performance over that time period is clearly relevant. He has shown that he is a highly effective and efficient scorer who is able to create his own shot. However, he has also shown that he is a poor defensive player, is not scrappy and it is questionable whether or not he helps players around him play their game better.
These factors in his game during the past 3 years, up to and including his latest injury are highy relevant. We lost a ton of games due to poor defense and KHurt played a significant role in that. If he is able to "re-invent" himself where his defense improves, becomes more scrappy and helps others play better then I think he would be great for this team. If he does not make changes, I think we will continue to lose many, many games with his style of play.
These factors in his game during the past 3 years, up to and including his latest injury are highy relevant. We lost a ton of games due to poor defense and KHurt played a significant role in that. If he is able to "re-invent" himself where his defense improves, becomes more scrappy and helps others play better then I think he would be great for this team. If he does not make changes, I think we will continue to lose many, many games with his style of play.
Absolutely not. Beno is a mediocre talent. My hope is that Beno can continue to impress, showcase his "talent" and Petrie gets a nice offer from some GM for his services. Even if we traded Beno prior to the trade deadline and neither Martin nor Garcia had come back from injury, I'd still be in favor of the trade if it made sense talent-wise.
The Kings have won a whopping three games in a row with Beno playing as a starter. Let's not get too excited jumping to the conclusion that Beno starting is the key to the success of this team. He was in fact one of the keys to the Kings lack of success last year.
The Kings have won a whopping three games in a row with Beno playing as a starter. Let's not get too excited jumping to the conclusion that Beno starting is the key to the success of this team. He was in fact one of the keys to the Kings lack of success last year.
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I'm sure you have all noticed that the Kings are 4-0 without Kevin Martin. But how is a team able to suddenly start winning after losing a 30 ppg scorer? What does this mean? Call me crazy but I genuinely believe that this team is better without Kevin Martin. Yes, it's too early for me to put my finger on why exactly they are better without him, but a 4-game winning streak is sufficient evidence to at least demonstrate that this team can play hard, if not harder, without him. No offense to Kevin, but his game is the exact opposite of the play that has gotten this team to 5-4. I'm sorry to say this, but the guy is soft. Especially on the defensive end. We've been playing tough, scrappy, basketball and hard-nosed defense. When do you see Kevin scrambling or diving for loose balls? Please don't come at me with the "You're just bashing KMart" stuff, I like the guy, I'm simply giving my opinion on an observation that is a 4-game winning streak. These guys are hungry.
The way the team is playing right now, I would definitely like to see Kmart come off the bench when healthy..
First of all, the Beno/Evans starting combo looks real nice.
Secondly, I don't want to risk putting Beno back on the bench and possibly seeing him start sucking donkey butt
Finally, Martin would be a great guy to bring off the bench...he will easily destroy the other teams' bench with his scoring
First of all, the Beno/Evans starting combo looks real nice.
Secondly, I don't want to risk putting Beno back on the bench and possibly seeing him start sucking donkey butt
Finally, Martin would be a great guy to bring off the bench...he will easily destroy the other teams' bench with his scoring