Potential Free agent/trade/sign tracker
- Thread starter iowamcnabb
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Here is a good explanation:
As Westerholm explained, like many nicknames, Time Lord’s origins trace back to Twitter — specifically a place known as “Weird Celtics Twitter.”
Ryan Hebert, who goes by @HebertofRiffs on the platform and is one the more prolific Weird Celtics Twitter personalities, takes credit for helping spur the nickname. Hebert told Westerholm that he had been a fan of Williams during the center’s college days at Texas A&M University. And, of course, as a Celtics fan, he thought the under-hyped defensive star could be a perfect fit in Boston.
However, in the days leading up to — and even after — the 2018 NBA Draft, some experts raised questions about the undoubtedly talented Williams’s work ethic and “motor.” When he fell to the Celtics in the late first round, Hebert and his Weird Celtics Twitter peers were ecstatic. However, when Williams missed that first conference call and flight, it seemed to confirm the doubts in the minds of skeptics.
“Robert Williams’ Celtics career off to worst start imaginable,” read a WEEI.com headline in July, before the rookie had even suited up for a game for the Celtics.
Hebert felt the general reaction in the media to those few initial mistakes was a bit dramatic.
“Local writers and talk-radio people overreacted, and the whole point of Weird Celtics Twitter is to make fun of them and media in general being too uptight,” he told Westerholm.
In an attempt to support Williams and get under the skin of those “uptight” media figures, Hebert and friends began joking that the rookie hadn’t actually been late, per se, but was simply “operating on a different timeline concurrent to the one we are in,” like some sort of basketball-playing “Doctor Who” character.
And thus, Time Lord was born.
As Westerholm explained, like many nicknames, Time Lord’s origins trace back to Twitter — specifically a place known as “Weird Celtics Twitter.”
Ryan Hebert, who goes by @HebertofRiffs on the platform and is one the more prolific Weird Celtics Twitter personalities, takes credit for helping spur the nickname. Hebert told Westerholm that he had been a fan of Williams during the center’s college days at Texas A&M University. And, of course, as a Celtics fan, he thought the under-hyped defensive star could be a perfect fit in Boston.
However, in the days leading up to — and even after — the 2018 NBA Draft, some experts raised questions about the undoubtedly talented Williams’s work ethic and “motor.” When he fell to the Celtics in the late first round, Hebert and his Weird Celtics Twitter peers were ecstatic. However, when Williams missed that first conference call and flight, it seemed to confirm the doubts in the minds of skeptics.
“Robert Williams’ Celtics career off to worst start imaginable,” read a WEEI.com headline in July, before the rookie had even suited up for a game for the Celtics.
Hebert felt the general reaction in the media to those few initial mistakes was a bit dramatic.
“Local writers and talk-radio people overreacted, and the whole point of Weird Celtics Twitter is to make fun of them and media in general being too uptight,” he told Westerholm.
In an attempt to support Williams and get under the skin of those “uptight” media figures, Hebert and friends began joking that the rookie hadn’t actually been late, per se, but was simply “operating on a different timeline concurrent to the one we are in,” like some sort of basketball-playing “Doctor Who” character.
And thus, Time Lord was born.
OK, so "Time Lord" talk aside...
For the Blazers trade, we don't need to include Len so far as salaries go, and I can't imagine they covet him given they would have Ayton and Clingan in front of him. I'd much rather keep Len as a full-sized backup C and only send Huerter. We do have that empty roster spot to work with. (If they are going to accept the trade with Len, they'll accept it without him, is what I think.)
The Nets trade works financially for both teams, and gets the Nets a bit more space under the apron.
The scary thing here is that we are sending out our only Expansion Draft Fodder contract in Colby. If there was to be an expansion draft in June 2025, as of right now we are good - we protect eight players (Fox, Sabonis, DeRozan, Murray, Monk, Huerter, Ellis, Carter) and dangle Colby, nobody else is under contract. But if we were to make this set of trades, all of a sudden we'd have to expose two players. We could protect eight (Fox, Sabonis, DeRozan, Keegan, Monk are five obvious protects) but would have to expose two of the following (Kris, Ellis, Carter, DFS, Williams) assuming that the expansion draft rules stay the same as the last two. Kris seems obvious, but oddly enough, we'd end up keeping him, because probably any one of those other four gets nabbed instead. Maybe Williams doesn't if he's not healthy (but then, the trade failed). DFS has a player option so exposing him is also dangerous - expansion teams love taking players who then opt out so that they don't have to worry about the salary ceiling the first couple of years. Ellis and Carter are insta-gone if we expose them.
Now, we don't KNOW that there will be an expansion draft this year (in fact, that's a quick turnaround, but we've seen it happen before), but if there is one, and we make these trades, we get caught a bit with our pants down. For that reason alone I might rather send McLaughlin (once Carter is back) or Orlando than Colby in the Nets deal. If they just want the pick, maybe they still do it?
For the Blazers trade, we don't need to include Len so far as salaries go, and I can't imagine they covet him given they would have Ayton and Clingan in front of him. I'd much rather keep Len as a full-sized backup C and only send Huerter. We do have that empty roster spot to work with. (If they are going to accept the trade with Len, they'll accept it without him, is what I think.)
The Nets trade works financially for both teams, and gets the Nets a bit more space under the apron.
The scary thing here is that we are sending out our only Expansion Draft Fodder contract in Colby. If there was to be an expansion draft in June 2025, as of right now we are good - we protect eight players (Fox, Sabonis, DeRozan, Murray, Monk, Huerter, Ellis, Carter) and dangle Colby, nobody else is under contract. But if we were to make this set of trades, all of a sudden we'd have to expose two players. We could protect eight (Fox, Sabonis, DeRozan, Keegan, Monk are five obvious protects) but would have to expose two of the following (Kris, Ellis, Carter, DFS, Williams) assuming that the expansion draft rules stay the same as the last two. Kris seems obvious, but oddly enough, we'd end up keeping him, because probably any one of those other four gets nabbed instead. Maybe Williams doesn't if he's not healthy (but then, the trade failed). DFS has a player option so exposing him is also dangerous - expansion teams love taking players who then opt out so that they don't have to worry about the salary ceiling the first couple of years. Ellis and Carter are insta-gone if we expose them.
Now, we don't KNOW that there will be an expansion draft this year (in fact, that's a quick turnaround, but we've seen it happen before), but if there is one, and we make these trades, we get caught a bit with our pants down. For that reason alone I might rather send McLaughlin (once Carter is back) or Orlando than Colby in the Nets deal. If they just want the pick, maybe they still do it?
Just listened to the “early season trade market” episode of Game theory podcast and they figured the hot names on the market for about 6-8 playoff teams would be Time Lord, Nance Jr, Brooklyn boys and a few Wizards. Nance would be another great get but I think he is expiring. Going to be interesting to see what other names we start seeing
I'm not looking forward to another trade deadline full of sweetheart deals which help the Lakers to shore up all their weaknesses in time for a playoff run. Please don't let the Lakers pick up Time Lord for practically nothing while we keep our Len/Lyles backup rotation and just punt on any idea of improving our defense.
yeh we are going to have a lot of competition for those 3 and d role players we need. IMO we need to thin out the guards at the deadline not only because we need more size and defense at the 3/4/5 but we also need to make room for Carter. He is a different maker on defense, I want him playing minutes right away when he is cleared. Get us a stud wing/big defender and insert Carter in the rotation and the grit of the team totally changes.
Waiting until the deadline to make moves might be a mistake this year. Something needs to happen now to shake up this bench unit. Monte needs to get a backup PF/C who can protect the paint and a small forward who can handle some of those difficult defensive assignments we're forcing Keegan to handle every night so he can focus more on his offense. Devin Carter is likely still a month away but we have enough guard depth to move Huerter in a deal now. Monk is back and Jordan McLaughlin is too good to stay glued to the bench.
Kevin Huerter, Trey Lyles, Colby Jones, Alex Len, and Doug McDermott -- that's $31 million worth of outgoing salary that Monte can use to match contracts. There's no reason to go after starters at this point so I don't think he needs to throw in any future first round picks. Just get us those two guys -- a defensive forward and a defensive big -- and then fill in the rest of the roster spots with free agents or G-League callups. Try to find some guys who don't shy away from contact.
Kevin Huerter, Trey Lyles, Colby Jones, Alex Len, and Doug McDermott -- that's $31 million worth of outgoing salary that Monte can use to match contracts. There's no reason to go after starters at this point so I don't think he needs to throw in any future first round picks. Just get us those two guys -- a defensive forward and a defensive big -- and then fill in the rest of the roster spots with free agents or G-League callups. Try to find some guys who don't shy away from contact.
IMO there isn’t anyone that is available that can be had for those players, first round picks are probably going to be required. We don’t have many second rounders to work with so stacking a bunch of those together isn’t an option.
Who do you think could be had that fits those descriptions without attaching real draft compensation?
Who do you think could be had that fits those descriptions without attaching real draft compensation?
Nobody trades first round picks for bench role-players. All we would be doing here is offering salary dumps to pick up veterans on bad teams who are no where near being competitive so that those teams can clear out some cap space and tank for Cooper Flagg. I'm only looking at lotto teams with veterans they probably don't want anymore:
Atlanta (Capela, Hunter)
Toronto (Boucher, Poeltl?)
Philly (Drummond, Martin)
Washington (Valanciunas?)
Portland (Thybulle, Williams III)
Utah (Collins?)
New Orleans (nobody really -- and they might not be committed to tanking yet)
Capela, Poeltl, Valanciunas, and Collins all have some claim to being starter level players still but given their current contracts and team situations, I don't think their teams are in position to demand starter level compensation for them.
Atlanta (Capela, Hunter)
Toronto (Boucher, Poeltl?)
Philly (Drummond, Martin)
Washington (Valanciunas?)
Portland (Thybulle, Williams III)
Utah (Collins?)
New Orleans (nobody really -- and they might not be committed to tanking yet)
Capela, Poeltl, Valanciunas, and Collins all have some claim to being starter level players still but given their current contracts and team situations, I don't think their teams are in position to demand starter level compensation for them.
It’s an interesting list. IMO Bob and Poeltl would require starter compensation. Capela is a free agent after this year so if you trade for him that comes off the books at years end, however you no longer have that salary to match in a future trade. Val is at least somewhat interesting as a talent upgrade over Len but he doesn’t help our defense or shooting.
How about John Collins and Walker Kessler for matching salary and a protected first? Imo we are 2 forwards/big short of what we need so I like the idea of finding a duo to trade for. Collins/walker, Bob/Murray or Thybulle, DFS/Sharpe
How about John Collins and Walker Kessler for matching salary and a protected first? Imo we are 2 forwards/big short of what we need so I like the idea of finding a duo to trade for. Collins/walker, Bob/Murray or Thybulle, DFS/Sharpe
Actually, I disagree. I think looking at this as at least a 1 year test is the way to go. If Huerter falls out of the rotation, he falls out. I would assume if Monte makes a move it will be only on money that doesn't extend into 26-27 when his cap is going to basically be blown to heck on mostly 6 players. Monte landed DeMar, I think that definitively excludes most if not all the rumored options of the last year and half. I mean unless he's will to move Keegan or let Fox walk. Which I doubt is going to happen.
As long as he comes off the books great, but really? Capela is going to help this team how? In the the 10 minutes he'd end up getting as a backup C? haha. If the Kings could open up some salary padding this summer to maybe use the MLE that might work but then his real value is as an expiring which would probably require compensation. Unless maybe the Kings could send back Huerter and release any protections on that pick of course. I don't dislike the idea of Hunter but there's no way since his contract extends into the danger area. You'd have Fox at potentially 50-60, Keegan at 20-30, Monk at 20+, DDR at 25+, Hunter at 25+, and Domas at 46+. I don't think so, lol.
What do we gain by waiting a year to make any changes? At that point we either are relevant or we aren't and if we're not it might already be too late to rebuild around the Fox / Sabonis pairing. We're currently going through a rough patch but a 5 game winning streak puts us back in the top 8. Sure the top 10 spots in the West remain ultra competitive but is there anyone here you'd actually be afraid to face in the playoffs? If we figure out our issues first, as in now not in mid-February, we still have a lot of runway left to build momentum for the playoffs.
So as a pet peeve, I really wish we were able to converse in "% Of Salary Cap" instead of literal dollar values. It would be a lot easier to say <number kinda arbitrary> "Well, that adds up to 105% of the cap, and the tax kicks in at 120% and we'd be hard-capped at 125%. So we've got 15-20% to play with, and min guys come in at about 1.5%, so..." rather than, "Oh, geez, $180M, that looks scary, what's the cap again? Where are the tax/aprons?"
When max extensions and the like are given out, they actually literally come in %age of the cap, which is why future years are often "estimates" on salary sites. Why not just put everything in terms of %age and make it easier?
When max extensions and the like are given out, they actually literally come in %age of the cap, which is why future years are often "estimates" on salary sites. Why not just put everything in terms of %age and make it easier?
In the summer Monte can maybe have that pick due off his back for 1 thing and could make a major change if need be. Then on draft night see where teams sit and what's out there. If it's that bad maybe Monte even does a soft reset around Keegan, Carter, and Keon, who knows. If Monte can go out and say get a need guy like DFS for a non valued piece like Huerter, great, but don't be trading 1st round picks. If Monte can cut a year off of Huerters deal that could open up free use of his MLE this summer, great. But those things are not worth moving valueable picks for at this point. If the Kings clear issue was they needed another player of a certain type then fine, but it's not fully defined to be that as of yet, we know what's going on. The shooting from the shooters is abysmal and the team is in transition to more of a grindy team as opposed to the DHO one they were because now teams aren't biting on it as much. It's also the same 3 point defense that has sucked for 3 years is even worse because teams know you just have to keep shooting 3's at this point.
Yeah, but we don't actually know for sure what any of the numbers are anyway and even if we did it's probably wrong, lol. Especially with incentives and future deals. All we can say is teams with a salary structure like that seem to be a little concerned about their cap so the Kings would likely be as well. And we know that if those limits go up it's coinciding with salaries going up as well so what's the difference? Fox not getting that mega max could be important and useful. Look at James Harden taking less money a few years ago, it can certainly matter in terms of building out your team. The guys that look to be set in 26 will likely all be making 20+ a year at the minimum with Devin Carter being the only one under it.
I was actually thinking we needed this a few days ago and was starting to think of some trade ideas for Isaiah Stewart. He may be flirting with that borderline between “mean” & “psychopath,” but we need someone like that to give us that edge and energy to bring the team along.
Crowder definitely gave us that yesterday, but I see someone like Stewart at least being more productive on the floor while still providing that same type of energy. Stewart has a lot of attributes that we could use…
I know this is a Crowder thread, but I think it will be important to have a “mean guy” on this roster who’s at least logging 20+ min a night. Crowder filled that role last night but I question if he still has enough left in the tank to really be a guy who gets 20+ min a night on a playoff team. Hopefully he does!
MOD NOTE: I left this post in the Jae Crowder thread but a lot of it is about Isaiah Stewart and people might want to talk more about him so I also copied this here. -hrdboild
Crowder definitely gave us that yesterday, but I see someone like Stewart at least being more productive on the floor while still providing that same type of energy. Stewart has a lot of attributes that we could use…
- He’s got that mean, won’t back down, upper cut a guy Doug Christie style, dog mentality. Our team is filled with a bunch of “nice guys.” I’d even say that our coach is a “nice guy” (he’s no Mike Malone). Having someone like this on the team that gets consistent minutes is important.
- He’s got excellent length with a 7’4.75” wingspan and 9’0.5” standing reach and he’s also got great strength. He’s a guy that you can throw at a Zion, Giannis, Randle, etc. and at least have some chance that he won’t be overpowered physically and athletically.
- He’s a pretty good shooter from 3. Last season, he shot 38.3% on 4.4 3PA per 36 min. However, he hasn’t really taken many 3s this year but I think that has more to do with how they are playing him. According to basketball reference, 98% of his minutes have been at the C spot. Versus last year he only logged 24% of his minutes at C.
- He seems like a pretty good defender from what I’ve seen and definitely takes pride in putting in great effort on that side of the ball. He can move his feet pretty well for his size but also has really good length and strength to make him disruptive as well. Not to mention he’s becoming a pretty darn good shot blocker as well.
- His contract is also very affordable in that he makes $15 mil per year for the next 4 years with the last year being a team option. Only 23 years old
- He’s also only 23 and can grow with our core and continue to get better.
I know this is a Crowder thread, but I think it will be important to have a “mean guy” on this roster who’s at least logging 20+ min a night. Crowder filled that role last night but I question if he still has enough left in the tank to really be a guy who gets 20+ min a night on a playoff team. Hopefully he does!
MOD NOTE: I left this post in the Jae Crowder thread but a lot of it is about Isaiah Stewart and people might want to talk more about him so I also copied this here. -hrdboild
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After Robert Williams III (who is obviously going to be in high demand) I think Valanciunas makes the most sense as a trade target. I have no idea why Washington even signed him to that contract. That whole team is 3 years away from being 3 years away (to borrow the phrase) and they should just play Sarr, Coulibaly, Carrington, and George as many minutes as possible.
Valanciunas is on a very team friendly $10 mill per year deal with the third year only partially guaranteed and he's not eligible to be traded until after December 15th so we'll see what his market is. With so many teams in the West jockeying for playoff positioning and only a few wins separating them, the prices for role-players are probably going to be higher than we would like this year.
Valanciunas is on a very team friendly $10 mill per year deal with the third year only partially guaranteed and he's not eligible to be traded until after December 15th so we'll see what his market is. With so many teams in the West jockeying for playoff positioning and only a few wins separating them, the prices for role-players are probably going to be higher than we would like this year.
I also like the idea of Isaiah Stewart with the added bonus that Detroit is in desperate need of shooting and Stewart's contract ($15m) easily matches with Kevin Huerter ($16.8m). So we just need to convince them to look at K'Von's career shooting splits not his season-so-far shooting splits and we could argue that he might help them make the playoffs this season with a bounce back second half.
Val is is certainly someone to monitor. On the Insiders they proposed a trade of Val and Kuz for Huerter, Carter and Lyles. On paper that is probably a fair deal but I’m way too high on Carter to include him in trades before we even get a look at him. Kuz doesn’t really fill a need for us anymore and the one downside to Val is he doesn’t offer much rim protection or versatility. On a personal level, I’d love to see Kev land somewhere on the east coast, I can see him reviving his career back home.
Yeah, I don't agree with that. Didn't want Kuz, still don't. The Kings could have had him on draft night but Carter >>> Kuz in Monte's mind. And again, it's a cap thing. That's adding 30 million in salary to the cap in 26-27 on a backup C and a player you really don't need AT ALL, especially with DeRozan here. Adding Valanciunas is probably doable leaving enough space to use the MLE at some point.
The Lyles injury could be a blessing in disguise. Gives the front office a 10 plus game sample size to see if IJ does enough to be a back up 4 this year. I’d still probably rather take a risk on Time Lord over Val but it’s hard to know what the value of Val would be. Don’t think they could get a first for him unless the Lakers get desperate. Would they take just Kev in hopes of reviving his career? Maybe
Which teams? I’ve come up with Lakers, Clippers (back up) Denver (back up) New York (back up) Kings (back up).
The only team I can see giving up a first is the Lakers and that would be a bad decision. Maybe New York if they have any left and they aren’t confident in getting Mitch Rob back. The rest would have to be some other compensation imo
The only team I can see giving up a first is the Lakers and that would be a bad decision. Maybe New York if they have any left and they aren’t confident in getting Mitch Rob back. The rest would have to be some other compensation imo
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