Looking ahead to the 2023 Draft

[SacTownKid]

Why? I don't think Edey is capable of playing in the NBA. He can't just stand under the basket like he did at Purdue. They happen to have a 3 second rule in the NBA. They don't in college. He has zero game away from the basket. If he ends up one on one with a PG, he's toast.

I love Timme, but he's a borderline NBA player. I do think he'd be able to score in the post in the NBA and be a decent rebounder, but I think he would suffer greatly on defense. At best Timme would be sitting at the end of the bench. I hope I'm wrong about him because I'd love to see him have a career. I think he might have a future in Europe..

I think Edey could find a role like a Marjanovic but he's a little bit more skilled. We saw how impactful size in spurts can be with the way Len played in the playoffs. In a skill league I think Timme has a legit shot if he's with the right team. I think he can be a productive scorer at the next level. Skill translates nowadays more than ever before. I also think he's got decent touch and even at his older age for a draftee a 3 point shot isn't out of the question.

 

[Turgenev]

Outside of that, it's always a bunch of armchairs throwing out some seriously random guesses.

I propose a new format. Pick a non lottery player, explain why you think he will be worth something after pick #14, and after the rookie year let's reconvene to see who has the best scouting eye outside of the draft.

Perhaps you could lead by example rather than just complaining that the content doesn't meet your standards?

 

[sactowndog]

I think you're fairly spot on in describing both Murray and Lewis. I do think Lewis can play SF. He's going to be around 6'7.5" in shoes, but I agree that he has SG skills and plays a lot like a SG. I don't think we can go wrong with either one, I just think that Lewis has the tools to be a star down the road. But you're also right that Murray is probably more ready to step in and play right now and Max has some polishing to do. So it's pick your poison!

interesting to me the neither of you mentioned who is the better projected defender. We have offensive players. What we don’t have is a proficient 3 and D wing that can stop an opposing teams star player.

 

[sactowndog]

I think if Lewis, Murray, Coulibaly, or L. Miller are available we go with them.

I rank them Miller, Coulibaly, Lewis, Murray.

 

[funkykingston]

I believe this is the list of who is under contract for the Kings next season

C Sabonis, Holmes
PF -
SF Murray, Edwards*, Dozier**
SG Huerter, Monk
PG Fox, Mitchell

*The Kings have a team option on Edwards that they're likely to exercise
**Dozier has an unguaranteed deal for next season

I think it's likely that Lyles returns and Vezenkov is signed. I think it's probably 65/35 that Barnes is re-signed. If so, that would give

C Sabonis, Holmes
PF Barnes, Lyles, Vezenkov
SF Murray, Edwards*, Dozier**
SG Huerter, Monk
PG Fox, Mitchell

So what do the Kings need most? Well, if HB leaves they need a starting PF or to move Keegan to that spot and then they need a starting SF. IMO, starting Lyles or Vezenkov would be a downgrade. I think both can be key bench contributors, but aren't as good as Barnes as a starter.

If Barnes returns (and Lyles and/or Sasha are signed) then I think the clearest needs are (in order) an upgrade at backup center, a 2/3 wing, and a 3rd string PG.

When you have a lottery pick you draft for talent over everything else. When you are drafting at #24 I think you look a bit more at fit, but primarily at whether or not you're even getting a contributor on the NBA level at that point. It's not a huge risk to take an upside swing, but if the Kings are going to be a playoff team for a while, the most important thing is to come away at the least with a role player on a cost controlled contract.

So for me, Lewis and Coulibaly make a fair amount of sense. So does Cissoko. But if Dereck Lively II makes it to #24 I think there has to be strong consideration there. Same thing with Nnaji. #24 might be a bit early and he'll need some time, but he could be the backup center the Kings need.

I'm also probably higher than others on Colby Jones but right now, those five guys are on my radar if the Kings keep the pick.

 

[Tetsujin]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1658654965319991301

lol what in the actual hell are the Raptors going to do with Sensabaugh with OG, Barnes, Otto Porter Jr., and Siakam still on their roster? I thought they had enough of the “draft and acquire nothing but 6’5”-6’9” wing/forwards” experience at this point.

 

[bajaden]

I think Edey could find a role like a Marjanovic but he's a little bit more skilled. We saw how impactful size in spurts can be with the way Len played in the playoffs. In a skill league I think Timme has a legit shot if he's with the right team. I think he can be a productive scorer at the next level. Skill translates nowadays more than ever before. I also think he's got decent touch and even at his older age for a draftee a 3 point shot isn't out of the question.

Even if I were to concede to what you project, do you really want Marjanovic taking up a roster spot on your team. Not to mention, the Kings play a fast paced up and down the court game. Neither Edey nor Timme fit that scenario. Both would be nothing but dead weight sitting on the bench. That said, players like Edey just don't make it in the NBA. There are the occasional exceptions but they're very rare. I do think that Timme is a very skilled post player, but has little game away from the basket. The idea of using both our 2nd round picks on those two players in a very deep and talented draft is just mind blowing.

 

[bajaden]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1658654965319991301

lol what in the actual hell are the Raptors going to do with Sensabaugh with OG, Barnes, Otto Porter Jr., and Siakam still on their roster? I thought they had enough of the “draft and acquire nothing but 6’5”-6’9” wing/forwards” experience at this point.

I agree with you, but if I were to play the devils advocate, maybe they have some off season moves planned that would open up some roster spots at the SF and PF positions. I don't think that they're necessarily tired of players at those positions, but that they're tired of the current holders of those positions. I think they want to change the landscape with some new blood.

You know on paper, they looked like a very good team, but in reality, the results wern't there. Not sure who to blame. Obviously they aren't sure who to blame either, so it looks like they're going to clean house.

 

[bajaden]

I believe this is the list of who is under contract for the Kings next season

C Sabonis, Holmes
PF -
SF Murray, Edwards*, Dozier**
SG Huerter, Monk
PG Fox, Mitchell

*The Kings have a team option on Edwards that they're likely to exercise
**Dozier has an unguaranteed deal for next season

I think it's likely that Lyles returns and Vezenkov is signed. I think it's probably 65/35 that Barnes is re-signed. If so, that would give

C Sabonis, Holmes
PF Barnes, Lyles, Vezenkov
SF Murray, Edwards*, Dozier**
SG Huerter, Monk
PG Fox, Mitchell

So what do the Kings need most? Well, if HB leaves they need a starting PF or to move Keegan to that spot and then they need a starting SF. IMO, starting Lyles or Vezenkov would be a downgrade. I think both can be key bench contributors, but aren't as good as Barnes as a starter.

If Barnes returns (and Lyles and/or Sasha are signed) then I think the clearest needs are (in order) an upgrade at backup center, a 2/3 wing, and a 3rd string PG.

When you have a lottery pick you draft for talent over everything else. When you are drafting at #24 I think you look a bit more at fit, but primarily at whether or not you're even getting a contributor on the NBA level at that point. It's not a huge risk to take an upside swing, but if the Kings are going to be a playoff team for a while, the most important thing is to come away at the least with a role player on a cost controlled contract.

So for me, Lewis and Coulibaly make a fair amount of sense. So does Cissoko. But if Dereck Lively II makes it to #24 I think there has to be strong consideration there. Same thing with Nnaji. #24 might be a bit early and he'll need some time, but he could be the backup center the Kings need.

I'm also probably higher than others on Colby Jones but right now, those five guys are on my radar if the Kings keep the pick.

I agree with everything you said. When picking late in the first round, the talent tends to be more equal and you usually end up choosing between older talent and younger upside. It's where you hope your scouting dept did their job, and need starts to take president over best player available. Mainly because they start to meld together. All the players you mentioned are for the most part, upside players. Some are more skilled than others, but there's a reason that they're going this late in the 1st rd.

That said, it's also likely that one of them, maybe two, will end up being a top ten, maybe top five in this draft when they do a redraft 3 or 4 years from now. Thus the upside! By the way, I'm a big fan of Colby Jones. He's one of those Swiss army knife kind of player. He reminds me of Malcolm Brogdon. Not great at anything, but good at everything. I'd be happy with him on the Kings. He's not my first choice, but he's on my list of choices.

I think the biggest boom or bust player in the first round is G G Jackson. He's a player with great upside, but also a very low ceiling. Difficult to really judge him on his time at S. Carolina because the team just stunk, and how much that affected his development is difficult to judge. I wish him well though!

 

[206Fan]

I thoroughly dislike this thread because of the wildly differing opinions. Baja seems to be the only one who can pretty well lock down which players will be something at the next level.

Outside of that, it's always a bunch of armchairs throwing out some seriously random guesses.

I propose a new format. Pick a non lottery player, explain why you think he will be worth something after pick #14, and after the rookie year let's reconvene to see who has the best scouting eye outside of the draft.

lol what a post. This thread is 38 pages long, and I think this is the first time I've ever seen your name here. Is this your first time in a sports forum? We've all been here actively discussing 2023 draft prospects since last June. I'm so sorry that if it bothers you that we have pages discussing in-game performances of players. It's a draft thread... people are free to talk about whatever they want.

I don't see you making any posts about players. All I see is someone crying about a thread that they don't even contribute to. Go read up on the Ringer or something. Maybe their armchair writers can throw out better guesses than everyone else here

 

[iowamcnabb]

Combine games are on espn. I don’t follow college ball enough to know most of those guys but Amari Bailey played well. Just in the short bit I watched he kinda reminded me of Monk

 

[iowamcnabb]

Prosper too

 

[funkykingston]

I agree with everything you said. When picking late in the first round, the talent tends to be more equal and you usually end up choosing between older talent and younger upside. It's where you hope your scouting dept did their job, and need starts to take president over best player available. Mainly because they start to meld together. All the players you mentioned are for the most part, upside players. Some are more skilled than others, but there's a reason that they're going this late in the 1st rd.

That said, it's also likely that one of them, maybe two, will end up being a top ten, maybe top five in this draft when they do a redraft 3 or 4 years from now. Thus the upside! By the way, I'm a big fan of Colby Jones. He's one of those Swiss army knife kind of player. He reminds me of Malcolm Brogdon. Not great at anything, but good at everything. I'd be happy with him on the Kings. He's not my first choice, but he's on my list of choices.

I think the biggest boom or bust player in the first round is G G Jackson. He's a player with great upside, but also a very low ceiling. Difficult to really judge him on his time at S. Carolina because the team just stunk, and how much that affected his development is difficult to judge. I wish him well though!

GG Jackson concerns me as well. Jalen Hood-Schifino too. I'd be happy if both are off the board by the Kings pick. While it would be great if the Kings could land stars or borderline stars while picking in the 20s, but the one thing they can't afford to do is gamble on kids that don't end up being NBA contributors.

 

[SacTownKid]

Even if I were to concede to what you project, do you really want Marjanovic taking up a roster spot on your team. Not to mention, the Kings play a fast paced up and down the court game. Neither Edey nor Timme fit that scenario. Both would be nothing but dead weight sitting on the bench. That said, players like Edey just don't make it in the NBA. There are the occasional exceptions but they're very rare. I do think that Timme is a very skilled post player, but has little game away from the basket. The idea of using both our 2nd round picks on those two players in a very deep and talented draft is just mind blowing.

Oh, I think we have a miscommunication here then, I wasn't saying draft both of them. I said Edey OR Timme. Overall we're talking about 2nd rounders and I can't remember the numbers but someone like Boban has way outlasted the vast majority of 2nd rounders over a 5-7 year period in terms of pure numbers and odds so if you find someone like that in the 2nd it's actually a success. I'm not sure if they intend to keep Queta but Queta and Edey or even Timme as your frontcourt depth is a pretty decent variety. The truth is I personally wouldn't be surprised to see either one of the 2nd rounders moved/sold, or the player just cut at some point anyway.

 

[bajaden]

Oh, I think we have a miscommunication here then, I wasn't saying draft both of them. I said Edey OR Timme. Overall we're talking about 2nd rounders and I can't remember the numbers but someone like Boban has way outlasted the vast majority of 2nd rounders over a 5-7 year period in terms of pure numbers and odds so if you find someone like that in the 2nd it's actually a success. I'm not sure if they intend to keep Queta but Queta and Edey or even Timme as your frontcourt depth is a pretty decent variety. The truth is I personally wouldn't be surprised to see either one of the 2nd rounders moved/sold, or the player just cut at some point anyway.

Well that makes a bit more sense. Look, if the Kings want to take a flyer on Timme with our 2nd pick in the 2nd rd, fine! But I wouldn't touch Edey with a ten foot pole. I don't wish any ill will on Edey. I actually hope I'm wrong for his sake. But between last year and this season, I've probably seen him play 30 times, and I wouldn't waste a draft pick on him. Here's the problem I would have with drafting Timme. It's likely there will be other players available that are more talented than him, and I'm sorry, I would have to take one of them first.

It's also possible that Timme goes undrafted. If so, the Kings could pounce then!

 

[iowamcnabb]

A draft guy on the Locked on Kings podcast has Jaime Jaquez as one of the few guys he thinks the kings could draft. Said he expects him to rise into the first round over the next few weeks

 

[bajaden]

Prosper too

Prosper played very well today. For those not familiar, were referring to Olivier-Maxenge Prosper who played for Marquette this past season. He played very well at the combine. A few others that played very well were Brandin Podziemski, who they had playing PG today, and he certainly rose to the occasion. He impressed the hell out of me, not just with his passing, but his ability to set up his teammates. Driving into the lane and making bounce passes in close quarters. Not sure how many assists he ended up with but he had 6 the last time I looked and no turnovers. He didn't shoot the ball much, but made the shots he took except for one floater, and a halfcourt shot at the end of the first half. He also played solid defense for the most part.

The biggest surprise to me, and I admit that I've fallen asleep at the wheel on this player, but no more, he's certainly on my radar now. I'm referring to Tristan Vukcevic, a 6'11" center from Serbia. He's very very skilled. I don't remember him missing any of his shots and I believe he ended up with 21 points, maybe 22. He also rebounded well. He scored from everywhere on the floor, starting off by hitting 2 three's in a row, and then a 16 foot stepback fade away jumpshot. He also scored in the post with excellent footwork, and a touch of bully ball. He even made some nice passes. Defensively, I couldn't tell you in that format where for the most part there isn't a lot of defense played.

Others that played well were, Emanuel Miller, Johni Broome, Judah Mintz, and I thought Emoni Bates showed some restraint instead of trying to force up shots in a crowd. He made some nice passes and his shot looked good. Isaiah Wong was very impressive and put on a shooting clinic. I'd call him more of a combo guard than a pg. He's very athletic and he can run a team, but more in the mode of Monk. But he can light it up and he looked like a solid defender. Ben Shepard also impressed me with his shooting and his court awareness. I think he's NBA material at some point. Didn't see much out of Azuolas Tubelis, the 6'11" PF/C from Arizona. Partly because the guards were dominating on his team.

Some other players that I thought played well but didn't put up any big stats are Jalen Wilson, Ricky Council, Amari Bailey, and lest I forget, Oscar Tshiebwe who had a double/double. He had 15 boards when I checked last. But to sum it up, the most impressive player in my opinion was Vukcevic. He likely helped himself draftwise. Can't wait to see how he plays tomorrow. He may have inched his way into the bottom of the first rd. At minimum, the top of the 2nd.

 

[PorchSurfin]

lol what a post. This thread is 38 pages long, and I think this is the first time I've ever seen your name here. Is this your first time in a sports forum? We've all been here actively discussing 2023 draft prospects since last June. I'm so sorry that if it bothers you that we have pages discussing in-game performances of players. It's a draft thread... people are free to talk about whatever they want.

I don't see you making any posts about players. All I see is someone crying about a thread that they don't even contribute to. Go read up on the Ringer or something. Maybe their armchair writers can throw out better guesses than everyone else here

I appreciate what you are doing, but being so epically wrong is a problem.

That's all.

 

[Telemachus]

A draft guy on the Locked on Kings podcast has Jaime Jaquez as one of the few guys he thinks the kings could draft. Said he expects him to rise into the first round over the next few weeks

I heard that to, but just don't see it. He has always looked to me like a solid college player who at best is the 11th or 12th man on an NBA team.

 

[The_Jamal]

I appreciate what you are doing, but being so epically wrong is a problem.

That's all.

Literally.... why?

I fought nearly everybody here that IT2 was an elite starter and not just some 6th man sparkplug
I thought Thomas Robinson was going to be a star.
I thought Vanderbilt was the easiest breakout candidate ever 2 years ago.


Point is I've had some really great takes that aged super well and some really god awful takes that should get my basketball fan card revoked on this forum. But that's actually the whole fun of it; give your 2 cents and have a bunch of other people tell you why it's a good idea or why it's dumb. And eventually you see who was right. Being the "Actually none of what we talk about matters, so lets just wait and see what happens and there's no point to discuss anything at all" guy is an incredibly boring way to be a fan.

 

[The_Jamal]

I believe this is the list of who is under contract for the Kings next season

C Sabonis, Holmes
PF -
SF Murray, Edwards*, Dozier**
SG Huerter, Monk
PG Fox, Mitchell

*The Kings have a team option on Edwards that they're likely to exercise
**Dozier has an unguaranteed deal for next season

I think it's likely that Lyles returns and Vezenkov is signed. I think it's probably 65/35 that Barnes is re-signed. If so, that would give

C Sabonis, Holmes
PF Barnes, Lyles, Vezenkov
SF Murray, Edwards*, Dozier**
SG Huerter, Monk
PG Fox, Mitchell

So what do the Kings need most? Well, if HB leaves they need a starting PF or to move Keegan to that spot and then they need a starting SF. IMO, starting Lyles or Vezenkov would be a downgrade. I think both can be key bench contributors, but aren't as good as Barnes as a starter.

If Barnes returns (and Lyles and/or Sasha are signed) then I think the clearest needs are (in order) an upgrade at backup center, a 2/3 wing, and a 3rd string PG.

When you have a lottery pick you draft for talent over everything else. When you are drafting at #24 I think you look a bit more at fit, but primarily at whether or not you're even getting a contributor on the NBA level at that point. It's not a huge risk to take an upside swing, but if the Kings are going to be a playoff team for a while, the most important thing is to come away at the least with a role player on a cost controlled contract.

So for me, Lewis and Coulibaly make a fair amount of sense. So does Cissoko. But if Dereck Lively II makes it to #24 I think there has to be strong consideration there. Same thing with Nnaji. #24 might be a bit early and he'll need some time, but he could be the backup center the Kings need.

I'm also probably higher than others on Colby Jones but right now, those five guys are on my radar if the Kings keep the pick.

Colby Jones was one of the first guys to catch my eye in this draft. But I'm a sucker for the "do everything" sort of prospects that don't have a glaring weakness on the floor.

I think the big worry is that if the shot actually isn't real, that he's just Evan Turner on the high end and Denzel Valentine on the low end if he never learns to shoot. We should probably aim a little higher than "alright-ish role player"

 

[Telemachus]

Literally.... why?

I fought nearly everybody here that IT2 was an elite starter and not just some 6th man sparkplug
I thought Thomas Robinson was going to be a star.
I thought Vanderbilt was the easiest breakout candidate ever 2 years ago.


Point is I've had some really great takes that aged super well and some really god awful takes that should get my basketball fan card revoked on this forum. But that's actually the whole fun of it; give your 2 cents and have a bunch of other people tell you why it's a good idea or why it's dumb. And eventually you see who was right. Being the "Actually none of what we talk about matters, so lets just wait and see what happens and there's no point to discuss anything at all" guy is an incredibly boring way to be a fan.

I follow a lot of guys who primarily cover the draft all year long. They disagree with each other all the time. It is very far from an exact science.

 

[The Effort Police]

Literally.... why?

I fought nearly everybody here that IT2 was an elite starter and not just some 6th man sparkplug
I thought Thomas Robinson was going to be a star.
I thought Vanderbilt was the easiest breakout candidate ever 2 years ago.


Point is I've had some really great takes that aged super well and some really god awful takes that should get my basketball fan card revoked on this forum. But that's actually the whole fun of it; give your 2 cents and have a bunch of other people tell you why it's a good idea or why it's dumb. And eventually you see who was right. Being the "Actually none of what we talk about matters, so lets just wait and see what happens and there's no point to discuss anything at all" guy is an incredibly boring way to be a fan.

Literally everyone has great draft takes and bad draft takes.

I said draft OG 15 over JJ, damn hedging your bet with a "safe" pick.

I also thought Ben McLemore was going to be a star.

I would also point out the Bagley and Papa G picks, but I think everyone can and did call those.

Even a certain someone who thinks his takes are God's gift to basketball has Bouknight as a absolute certified L moment.

 

[miltonap]

Saw this clip of this guy today and I was super super impressed

Court vision and passing seem pretty elite to me which doesn't grow on trees and seems super athletic as well

Not 100% convinced on his jump shot, it looked OK to me, but I came away really impressed

Also saw this clip where I was able to see more of his shooting and free throws as well.

 

[serbiangoat]

Wow apparently Vukcevic's game is much better suited to the NBA game according to Serbian News in 16minutes at the combine he had 21points , I think he was just under way to much stress/pressure in that situation he was in. Europe is pure garbage when it comes to developing talent that's 18-22 imo. His defense still looks dreadful but.

 

[sactowndog]

Wow apparently Vukcevic's game is much better suited to the NBA game according to Serbian News in 16minutes at the combine he had 21points , I think he was just under way to much stress/pressure in that situation he was in. Europe is pure garbage when it comes to developing talent that's 18-22 imo. His defense still looks dreadful but.

damn that catch at the end was sweet. Kid has some great soft hands. Made me wonder if he had played water polo also. Great cross sport for basketball.

 

[The_Jamal]

Wow apparently Vukcevic's game is much better suited to the NBA game according to Serbian News in 16minutes at the combine he had 21points , I think he was just under way to much stress/pressure in that situation he was in. Europe is pure garbage when it comes to developing talent that's 18-22 imo. His defense still looks dreadful but.

Set shot looks a little slow, but that doesn't matter as much when you're that big. Showing some nice skills there.

 

[Tetsujin]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1659201286892589058

Local kid who plays a position of strength for us and isn’t exactly putting up the best workout video into the world but there are probably worse uses of a second round pick than Coleman Hawkins.

 

[Tetsujin]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1659265138296332304

 

[macadocious]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1659265138296332304

AKA there agents said “you can’t go up from here!”