Dave Joerger

[VF21]

I predict he will not return. This conversation above is occurring in the vacuum of what we see on the court, divorced from the reality of Dave's contract situation and the NBA landscape. Dave has one year left. No one likes being a lame duck, and teams don't like having a lame duck coach. Dave must be extended this offseason. Dave will likely demand four years guaranteed. After the post-trade swoon, I imagine the front office/ownership would not be comfortable with anything beyond a three year contract, with an option on the third year. Ideally, they would do a two year extension, with an option on the second year.

Given Dave's history, once talks stall he will request permission to interview with other teams, particularly the Wolves. In addition, he will demand that Williams be let go. Williams seems to be very good at his job. Also, Williams leaked, then Dave leaked, and Williams kept his head down for the remainder of the year while Dave and staff continued to act out. They even moaned to the media how "disrespected" they were that Vlade had Williams handle all of the staff extensions. That is extremely unprofessional.

Eventually, Vivek and the other owners are going to ask themselves, "Why are we negotiating with Dave and letting him make FO staffing decisions when the guy we really wanted three years ago, Luke Walton, is available, we have a perfect roster for him, and Vlade was teammates with him in 04-05?" This would not be a firing; this would be a mutual parting. Also, from listening to the national guys, I think the league would give a collective shoulder shrug about the move. IOW, this would not be like the Malone firing. Joerger is well regarded for his set plays on dead balls and coming out of timeouts, but the accolades end there. The rest of the league considers him to be pretty run-of-the-mill and a consummate office politician.

I find that nearly laughable and totally without basis in fact. You're making a lot of blanket statements and assumptions here that bear little relevance to what seems to be happening.

Dave will likely...

He will demand...

Vivek and the other owners will...

etc.

Since you're not in Sacramento, I guess you have to depend on "national guys" for a lot of Kings news, but I have to wonder why you haven't referenced the MULTIPLE mentions Joerger received in the discussion of COY.

If Bagley hadn't gotten injured, I strongly suspect we'd be in the #8 slot right now. That's a bit better than "run of the mill" when you're talking about a team that wasn't expected to even crawl out of the cellar - and Joerger deserves the credit for the improvement.

 

[PurpleHaze]

I think his wife loves their sprawling Shingle Springs ranch and equestrian training in mostly good Northern California weather compared to some other places they've lived.

 

[SacTownKid]

This is such a difficult question to ask without knowing how he season ends. I do believe things can go up, and conversely they could go down. That last hanging note of the season might determine a lot of things. The truth is, it's very rare for a coach to be brought in under the circumstances Dave Joerger was and then have them continue through the rebuild of a team. Dave Joerger was arguably perfect for a prior direction but the legitimate question must be asked if he's the perfect fit for this new direction. On the plus side Dave corrected many of the monumental mistakes of last year. Last year he coached his team in a way that had everyone believing that the Kings blew another multi-years worth of drafts when it wasn't true at all. Had he forged ahead with the grit and grind I doubt we are even having this conversation right now. We don't exactly know what the deal is behind the scenes but I do think it's telling if rumors of Vlade being pressured to extend coach Joerger and him telling those piping up that it was his decision to make are true. That could mean he understands all the positives and negatives going on in the locker room right now. Remember, Vlade as a player was known as THE locker room stabilizer. That's who he is so I'm sure if there are any lingering or potential issues there he has his finger on the pulse of it. All in all I'd rate Dave Joergers job this season as a positive. There are still on court issues with his decision making and play style but I don't think as of now you lose your job over it. Not by a long shot. I think he'll be back as of now, but I don't think any heavy handed extensions are in order yet.

 

[whozit]

This is such a difficult question to ask without knowing how he season ends. I do believe things can go up, and conversely they could go down. That last hanging note of the season might determine a lot of things. The truth is, it's very rare for a coach to be brought in under the circumstances Dave Joerger was and then have them continue through the rebuild of a team. Dave Joerger was arguably perfect for a prior direction but the legitimate question must be asked if he's the perfect fit for this new direction. On the plus side Dave corrected many of the monumental mistakes of last year. Last year he coached his team in a way that had everyone believing that the Kings blew another multi-years worth of drafts when it wasn't true at all. Had he forged ahead with the grit and grind I doubt we are even having this conversation right now. We don't exactly know what the deal is behind the scenes but I do think it's telling if rumors of Vlade being pressured to extend coach Joerger and him telling those piping up that it was his decision to make are true. That could mean he understands all the positives and negatives going on in the locker room right now. Remember, Vlade as a player was known as THE locker room stabilizer. That's who he is so I'm sure if there are any lingering or potential issues there he has his finger on the pulse of it. All in all I'd rate Dave Joergers job this season as a positive. There are still on court issues with his decision making and play style but I don't think as of now you lose your job over it. Not by a long shot. I think he'll be back as of now, but I don't think any heavy handed extensions are in order yet.

This post sums up why I voted needs to go and needs to stay. We don't know what if anything that is happening behind the scenes and that could make all the difference and I do trust Vlade to know that. He was the "consultant" (don't remember the title) before he was the man.

 

[Iced Espresso]

I will say this, not starting Barnes at the 3 immediately after the deadline baffled/annoyed me.

 

[Sac.1989]

Not having Bagley hasn't helped but moving Bogi from his most effective position on the bench spearheading our second unit hasn't worked, nor has Barnes at PF.

I can see the rationale for it, re Barnes at the 4. Stretch forward is of vital importance to us, even more so now given Fox's 3 pt regression in the second half of the season but it hasn't worked.

A fit Bagley should remedy some of our issues as is the FO dealing with our center position in FA with WCS.

I don't foresee this happening with much ease. Dave deserves credit for how far we have come but we have also fallen short in the second half of the season with his rotations strongly questioned. It will all make for a very interesting summer.

 

[Kingsfan23]

I will say this, not starting Barnes at the 3 immediately after the deadline baffled/annoyed me.

Many people, including the coach, view his position as a stretch 4.

I can see how it annoys you, if you don’t agree with it. But it shouldn’t baffle you to understand the first part

 

[Iced Espresso]

Many people, including the coach, view his position as a stretch 4.

I can see how it annoys you, if you don’t agree with it. But it shouldn’t baffle you to understand the first part

When you take into consideration Shump was also moved, and Bjelica went to the bench, and we also have Bagley it was baffling.

I still have no idea why Bogi was inserted into the starting lineup.

 

[FoxRocketFan]

He will be back. And rightfully so considering this season. Which was a success considering what the expectations were.

But the expectations for next season change drastically to playoffs birth at worst.
Though he needs support in the front office. More depth especially at the forward position would be helpful

 

[andjel]

lol, after all the messages over the past two weeks about how terrible Joerger is, one would thing that more than 2 out of 51 posters would put their name under their preference that he should not be back.

 

[pshn80]

The team is the best we have had in a long time. Joerger is the best coach we’ve had in a long time. I would be very upset if he was fired or resigned. He won’t be.

 

[206Fan]

I want him back next year and I see him coming back, however, how will we determine his success next year? Is it playoffs or bust? I think it is considering how we started hot this season. We're seeing what our players are capable of. The only player who I think might hit a wall next year is Buddy, but I don't think it'll be a big one. Maybe 16ppg instead of 20, but we have more than enough talent to make the playoffs.

With everything being said, what if a very good coach comes in and decides he wants to coach this team? What if they think they can turn our players into superstars? I think the Kings job is very tantalizing due to Fox + pieces. Erik Spoelstra? Doc Rivers?

 

[SLAB]

I want him back next year and I see him coming back, however, how will we determine his success next year? Is it playoffs or bust? I think it is considering how we started hot this season. We're seeing what our players are capable of. The only player who I think might hit a wall next year is Buddy, but I don't think it'll be a big one. Maybe 16ppg instead of 20, but we have more than enough talent to make the playoffs.

With everything being said, what if a very good coach comes in and decides he wants to coach this team? What if they think they can turn our players into superstars? I think the Kings job is very tantalizing due to Fox + pieces. Erik Spoelstra? Doc Rivers?

If an established coach like one of those guys says hello I kick Joerger to the curb in a second. Sorry Dave.

Don’t really see that happening though.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

The Kings will find it harder to make the playoffs next year.
All of the core players will need to make a major leap to be a playoff team.

Dallas has tons of money, Porzingas and their pick
Spurs will add another piece or 2 to keep themselves in the playoff picture.
Wolves have a lot of cap space
Clips will probably add a star
Lakers not sure what direction their going in

All supposition.

Also, why are so many on the Dallas bandwagon? People are seemingly enfatuated with names. When healthy, Porzingis never lifted NYK out of mediocrity. And now he’s coming back from a major injury with no guarantee he’ll be what he was let alone better. As good a rookie season as Luka has had, his team isn’t overachieving either. There’s really no reason to believe the Mavs will be much better until they prove otherwise.

The Spurs are an aging team that seems more on the decline than on the rise. Aldridge is no spring chicken and DeRozan is merely a good player, not great. SA isnt exactly a hotbed for free agents either, especially post TD, TP and Ginobili.

The Wolves have been expected to take the next step for a few years now, but are stuck in neutral.

Most expected the Lakers to be better than they are this season. Why should next season be any different? LeBron will be another year older. They don’t have a ton of cap space and are still a mess. It’s doubtful the Pels deal AD there, so unless they can get Kawhi to join, odds are good they won’t drastically improve either.

The one team that has the most potential of those you listed is the Clippers. They have Jerry West running things and are already better than the Lakers with a lot more potential to add to it.

I think the KINGS can and will be better than all but maybe 1 of these teams just through organic improvement from their young players.

 

[whozit]

lol, after all the messages over the past two weeks about how terrible Joerger is, one would thing that more than 2 out of 51 posters would put their name under their preference that he should not be back.

And one of those two voted, both should stay and go. And if you go into my post history you won't find me as one of the ones who have been hammering him.

 

[dude12]

Joerger is a coach capable of winning in the playoffs and or getting this team to the championship. I’m of the opinion that there are many head coaches in the nba just like him. I saw Spoelstra mentioned above that we should jump at him if he’s available. Miami is 31-35.....in the East no less. Now, I’m not going to bash Spoelstra because I think he’s really good, just like Joerger. But when you have Lebron and Wade and all of the other guys on the championship teams, you will be pretty damn good like any coach (see Steve Kerr).

Doc Rivers? Doing a damn good job this year, a quality coach for sure, even though he couldn’t get Griffin, CP3, Jordan, etc anywhere near sniffing a championship....remember those teams that came up short? Doc is doing a great job with this group.....because there are no expectations on this group.

Rick Carlisle.....used to be mentioned as a top coach.....when Dirk was young!
Pop.....sure was better with those hall of famers
Wonder kid in Boston......good coach, not the next coming unless he gets a better star, amirite
Brett Brown....really good coach once His best players became healthy

Point is, we have a very good coach. Don’t let the data point crowd sway you because wins and titles are not won on a spreadsheet. Don’t let the vocal minority sway you because, Joerger has a team not expected to do much playing .500 ball. It’s quite incredible.

 

[ppine]

"The future is so bright, I gotta wear shades." Pat McDonald.

 

[steelevt]

As much as I get on joerger for his lineup choices, he's a good coach overall. He's done something here that hasn't been done since the Adelman days. This team has grown a lot since he's been coach and I'm tired of the past instability and how it's affected the team. We have a good team and a good coach let's build upon and not dismantle please.

 

[ockingsfan]

As much as I get on joerger for his lineup choices, he's a good coach overall. He's done something here that hasn't been done since the Adelman days. This team has grown a lot since he's been coach and I'm tired of the past instability and how it's affected the team. We have a good team and a good coach let's build upon and not dismantle please.

I think Vlade knows the importance of stability and sticking with the right coach.

If you look at how Vlade runs the Kings, with keeping everything hush, hush on trades and to handling things in house, he is emulating how Geoff Petrie used to run the Kings. I think he looks at the Petrie blue print, with how he acquires talent too. He finds players with specific traits and skills and fills the voids, much like how Petrie used too. He runs a pretty tight ship (except for a few rouge leaks), which is very difficult in today's social media and internet rumor mills.

And with that, Vlade knows the importance of having a consistent coaching voice and system, much like the glory days the Kings had a steady voice in Adelman. The more time the players have in the same system, they will play more efficiently and more off instinct as the grow together.

I fully expect Vlade to re-sign coach Joeger to a long term deal this summer.

 

[John Galt]

I’m scared.

This all has a deja vu feel to me. I remember when people would chatter about Adelman’s deficiencies and suggest moving on, and I never thought it could happen because the world isn’t stupid. But it did.

Then after it seemed like years of basketball hell were over, I remember chatter about Malone’s deficiencies and suggestions that we move on, and I never thought it could happen because the world isn’t stupid. But it did.

Please world, don’t be stupid for a third time.

 

[Sac.1989]

I’m scared.

This all has a deja vu feel to me. I remember when people would chatter about Adelman’s deficiencies and suggest moving on, and I never thought it could happen because the world isn’t stupid. But it did.

Then after it seemed like years of basketball hell were over, I remember chatter about Malone’s deficiencies and suggestions that we move on, and I never thought it could happen because the world isn’t stupid. But it did.

Please world, don’t be stupid for a third time.

I dont think its a case of lighting striking for the third time however Vlade does have a lot to deal with this offseason:

- the politics of managing Dave and Brandon
- the fact Dave will most likely leverage his perceived positive influence on our record and roster in contract discussions
- the fact that the Minnesota job is very much available
- the fact that we need to address our C position with WCS upcoming RFA which is tied directly to Dave's rotations etc

There are many factors at hand and its not cut and dry.

 

[The Effort Police]

He'll be back next year unless Brandon Williams gets his way (which is a real possibility) since he's gotten his inexperienced talent to overachieve.

After that it's not so cut and dry. If the team stagnates in the next year or two the script will be flipped to underachieving for the talent they have and maybe a specific thing(s) he does will be pointed to as the culprit.

 

[John Galt]

I dont think its a case of lighting striking for the third time however Vlade does have a lot to deal with this offseason:

- the politics of managing Dave and Brandon
- the fact Dave will most likely leverage his perceived positive influence on our record and roster in contract discussions
- the fact that the Minnesota job is very much available
- the fact that we need to address our C position with WCS upcoming RFA which is tied directly to Dave's rotations etc

There are many factors at hand and its not cut and dry.

Sell me “Brandon”. Seriously. I thought he was getting credit for some peripheral ‘decent moves’ like Ferrell and Belly. I don’t see how he is central or sacred at all. Has he done cap magic? I could live the rest of my life as a Kings fan if Brandon Williams got eaten by a tiger tomorrow. Screw him.

I don’t understand any effort to marginalize Dave’s impact. He spoke of a 3 year plan. He’s executed ahead of schedule. He should leverage that... he should get paid.

 

[Sac.1989]

Sell me “Brandon”. Seriously. I thought he was getting credit for some peripheral ‘decent moves’ like Ferrell and Belly. I don’t see how he is central or sacred at all. Has he done cap magic? I could live the rest of my life as a Kings fan if Brandon Williams got eaten by a tiger tomorrow. Screw him.

I don’t understand any effort to marginalize Dave’s impact. He spoke of a 3 year plan. He’s executed ahead of schedule. He should leverage that... he should get paid.

If Brandon hasnt held any value he should have been banished, thats what gets me. Why have we kept him around and then had it all blow up again by having him involved in the contracts for Dave's staff ?

Vlade wants everyone to play nice but end of the day he is going to have to make strong decisions. It is clear Brandon and Dave will not cooperate with each other

 

[Livinthedream]

The fact that Brandon Williams didn't get fired may mean that we don't really know what was going on or have all the facts.

 

[SacTownKid]

lol, after all the messages over the past two weeks about how terrible Joerger is, one would thing that more than 2 out of 51 posters would put their name under their preference that he should not be back.

That's because people are too extreme in their assessment of in game criticism by others. Not any bad is all bad, nor is any good all good. Again, difficult point to ask the question but there are many ways that number could go up quite a bit before seasons end.

 

[SacTownKid]

I’m scared.

This all has a deja vu feel to me. I remember when people would chatter about Adelman’s deficiencies and suggest moving on, and I never thought it could happen because the world isn’t stupid. But it did.

Then after it seemed like years of basketball hell were over, I remember chatter about Malone’s deficiencies and suggestions that we move on, and I never thought it could happen because the world isn’t stupid. But it did.

Please world, don’t be stupid for a third time.

It also reminds one of the situation in Oakland when Mark Jackson was fired. It goes both ways sometimes.

 

[John Galt]

It also reminds one of the situation in Oakland when Mark Jackson was fired. It goes both ways sometimes.

Might remind you of that. It doesn’t remind me of that.

 

[macadocious]

Joerger will be granted a 2+1 eaxtension on top of next years contract. The +1 will be a mutual decision year.

His assistants (that he wants) will get one additional year to next year.

 

[63royals]

... It is clear Brandon and Dave will not cooperate with each other

And you know this how? Because everybody says so? Who's this "everybody" you're talking about? A bunch of people on social media? Or am I an idiot for questioning your sources? Is this the first time in the history of the world where we had a large organization and everyone agreed about absolutely everything, until this sinister plot to take over control of the team surfaced? Is this the first time in history that someone within an organization has tried to do some empire building or we've had some other office intrigue? Could it be that any problems have been resolved behind closed doors, and all anyone else has is speculation? Could it be that there is no longer any overlap in their responsibilities and so the possibility of conflict has been eliminated? Or that this whole thing actually is no big deal? The team is having an amazing season, and this is supposed to be really important why?