Willie Cauley-Stein: the 2018-19 Season watch

[kingsfan1984]

Can willie even manage to put his arm up to challenge a shot? I'm shocked how little resistance he gives at the rim. Bjelica is a bigger deterrent at the rim at this point.

Its mind boggling to me that with his athleticism (observe how he can explode for lobs) that he can't pick up 2.5 blocks a game...is there a weaker/softer starting center in the league than little light willie?

 

[Kingsfan23]

Can willie even manage to put his arm up to challenge a shot? I'm shocked how little resistance he gives at the rim. Bjelica is a bigger deterrent at the rim at this point.

Its mind boggling to me that with his athleticism (observe how he can explode for lobs) that he can't pick up 2.5 blocks a game...is there a weaker/softer starting center in the league than little light willie?

I don’t think he has a great motor, but it must be psychological too. Because a lot of it takes very little work, as in he’s at the point of the spot and just has to move/react. I’m thinking he’s either such a non aggressive guy that he doesn’t like to step on the offensive players toes by making a play on him, or there really is some deep seeded fears going on (like he mentioned stubbing his finger) etc

 

[midtowner]

Read those words haters:

“That’s the league now,” Cauley-Stein said. “Everybody’s got the ability to score. It’s the teams that trust each other. ... The more we care about each other, the more and more it’s going to be evident that’s why we’re winning.”

Totally in it for himself.

 

[dude12]

Just a sample but since they just beat the Jazz, the Kings outrebounded the Jazz. WCS outplayed Gobert.....again. If you just focused on rebounding and blocked shots, then you don’t appreciate what WCS is doing.

Gobert is a different type of Center. Should we focus on his deficiencies? He blocks shots, plays defense, controls the paint and rebounds. Offensively he’s limited.

Point being that WCS is really good for this team and some of his deficiencies are covered by the team as a whole but he brings a lot

 

[Livinthedream]

Just a sample but since they just beat the Jazz, the Kings outrebounded the Jazz. WCS outplayed Gobert.....again. If you just focused on rebounding and blocked shots, then you don’t appreciate what WCS is doing.

Gobert is a different type of Center. Should we focus on his deficiencies? He blocks shots, plays defense, controls the paint and rebounds. Offensively he’s limited.

Point being that WCS is really good for this team and some of his deficiencies are covered by the team as a whole but he brings a lot

Well said.

 

[kingsfan1984]

If you just focused on rebounding and blocked shots, then you don’t appreciate what WCS is doing.

...

Point being that WCS is really good for this team and some of his deficiencies are covered by the team as a whole but he brings a lot

I'm asking for WCS to raise his arm or, God forbid jump, to challenge a shot with more frequency than standing and watching a layup or dunk from 2 feet away.

The blocks bagley has been getting is exact same that wcs should be getting. He is getting a putrid 0.5 blocks a game which backs up what the eye sees.

challenge the "layup zone" at the rim with his length and leaping ability. Would make a huge difference. In games he does this he makes some spectacular plays

Our defense could be massively improved if wcs could provide more resistance around the rim.

You seem to imply I'm saying "get rid of him" because I'm asking for more? How's that different than saying I'd like Fox to improve his shooting or buddy his dribbling?

 

[sergmatt]

I'm asking for WCS to raise his arm or, God forbid jump, to challenge a shot with more frequency than standing and watching a layup or dunk from 2 feet away.

The blocks bagley has been getting is exact same that wcs should be getting. He is getting a putrid 0.5 blocks a game which backs up what the eye sees.

challenge the "layup zone" at the rim with his length and leaping ability. Would make a huge difference. In games he does this he makes some spectacular plays

Our defense could be massively improved if wcs could provide more resistance around the rim.

You seem to imply I'm saying "get rid of him" because I'm asking for more? How's that different than saying I'd like Fox to improve his shooting or buddy his dribbling?

All true and great points. Mitchell is only 6' 2" and drove to the basket on Willie multiple times and Willie didn't so much as raise an arm up let alone jump to try and block/alter the shots. Mitchell knew it too and knew that Willie wouldn't challenge him.

No doubt WCS is playing better this year and he does have some skills on both sides of the ball that really help this team. However for a team that wants to play fast and sometimes play small it's imperative that the lone big on the court at least attempt to be a defensive anchor. The lone big must challenge shots and at least try to protect the rim. There is no excuse for WCS not blocking at least 1.5 shots per game and altering more. He's tall, quick, and a great leaper......the problem is he's SAWFT.

 

[midtowner]

On this Holiday I am thankful for all the things that WCS does well.

And his pick and roll defense and floor running are stellar.

At Christmas I will wish for him to work on the defensive anchor stuff.

Peace

 

[Kingsfan23]

Just a sample but since they just beat the Jazz, the Kings outrebounded the Jazz. WCS outplayed Gobert.....again. If you just focused on rebounding and blocked shots, then you don’t appreciate what WCS is doing.

Gobert is a different type of Center. Should we focus on his deficiencies? He blocks shots, plays defense, controls the paint and rebounds. Offensively he’s limited.

Point being that WCS is really good for this team and some of his deficiencies are covered by the team as a whole but he brings a lot

If he was really good for the team it wouldn’t be in the bottom portion of interior D and rebounding

Just because the team is winning more and win last night doesn’t mean problems don’t exist.

He’s a give and take player now with his offensive improvement. Now it’s about getting him servicable in the paint so he’s just a giver to the Kings, because Kings can’t be really good with these issues.

Now, detractors have to reason if the pluses outweigh minuses, and how interchangeable the offensive production can be. Certainly before any big payday

WCS, I see what your doing offensively, now give us some sugar in the paint

 

[John Galt]

I used to be one of the meanest WCS detractors, because I was concerned about his motor and attitude. He is winning me over really fast.

If he is going to maintain this motor and attitude - if it is for real - then I want to give him the money. He can run and play in our style, with some theatric dunks, and a correct attitude.

I'm not gonna nitpick him if he is not a nightly double-double machine. He's doing more than enough to impress me this season.

 

[The_Jamal]

Can willie even manage to put his arm up to challenge a shot? I'm shocked how little resistance he gives at the rim. Bjelica is a bigger deterrent at the rim at this point.

Its mind boggling to me that with his athleticism (observe how he can explode for lobs) that he can't pick up 2.5 blocks a game...is there a weaker/softer starting center in the league than little light willie?

If he was really good for the team it wouldn’t be in the bottom portion of interior D and rebounding

Just because the team is winning more and win last night doesn’t mean problems don’t exist.

He’s a give and take player now with his offensive improvement. Now it’s about getting him servicable in the paint so he’s just a giver to the Kings, because Kings can’t be really good with these issues.

Now, detractors have to reason if the pluses outweigh minuses, and how interchangeable the offensive production can be. Certainly before any big payday

WCS, I see what your doing offensively, now give us some sugar in the paint

Sooooo.

With WCS on the floor, we're 6.2 points better defensively. We allow 50.4% TRB with him on the floor and 53.4% TRB with him off. We force teams into a 17.4% Turnover rate with him on the floor and 14.9% Turnover rate with him off. He's has a positive DBPM at 0.8 and a 1.21 DRPM.

No, he doesn't rack up blocked shots, but there's absolutely zero doubt he's been an impact for us defensively. He certainly hasn't been bad like some of you have been suggesting. Pretty much everything points to him being a middle of the pack starting center, which is a huge upgrade from where he was last season.

 

[sergmatt]

No, he doesn't rack up blocked shots, but there's absolutely zero doubt he's been an impact for us defensively. He certainly hasn't been bad like some of you have been suggesting. Pretty much everything points to him being a middle of the pack starting center, which is a huge upgrade from where he was last season.

True but why can't he be better? If he actually altered and blocked some shots he would be a better than average center. What's stopping him from blocking some shots or at least trying to? He has all of the physical tools to do so and right now he doesn't even try. I and others expect more from him because the skills are there to do more.

 

[Section 101]

What bugs me is not running back to protect the rim. Ya he is ahead of his man, but he's leaving his guards with no help in transition.

 

[kingsfan1984]

Sooooo.

With WCS on the floor, we're 6.2 points better defensively. We allow 50.4% TRB with him on the floor and 53.4% TRB with him off. We force teams into a 17.4% Turnover rate with him on the floor and 14.9% Turnover rate with him off. He's has a positive DBPM at 0.8 and a 1.21 DRPM.

No, he doesn't rack up blocked shots, but there's absolutely zero doubt he's been an impact for us defensively. He certainly hasn't been bad like some of you have been suggesting. Pretty much everything points to him being a middle of the pack starting center, which is a huge upgrade from where he was last season.

Soooooo

Good enough?

What's wrong with asking him to do more? It's well within his ability. And I would argue it would have a massively positive impact for the team.

You sighted we are 6.2 points better defensively with him on the floor....you dont want to see 10 points better? 12 better?

 

[bajaden]

All true and great points. Mitchell is only 6' 2" and drove to the basket on Willie multiple times and Willie didn't so much as raise an arm up let alone jump to try and block/alter the shots. Mitchell knew it too and knew that Willie wouldn't challenge him.

No doubt WCS is playing better this year and he does have some skills on both sides of the ball that really help this team. However for a team that wants to play fast and sometimes play small it's imperative that the lone big on the court at least attempt to be a defensive anchor. The lone big must challenge shots and at least try to protect the rim. There is no excuse for WCS not blocking at least 1.5 shots per game and altering more. He's tall, quick, and a great leaper......the problem is he's SAWFT.

Actually, go back and watch the game. Twice Willie stayed between Mitchell and caused him to miss on one occasion, and pass out on the other occasion, but Willie had position from the top of the circle. Another time he stayed with Mitchel he got called for a foul, which in my opinion, wasn't a foul. toward the end of the game Willie was in foul trouble, and if he had contested a couple of those shots, he likely would have fouled out of the game. Things aren't done in a vacuum.

Look, I'll be the first to admit that there are times when Willie seems to lose focus, but this season those times have been fewer. Sometimes things aren't as simple as they appear, and the player that looks like the culprit, isn't. In this last game, keeping Willie on the floor was more important than contesting a Mitchell shot that might result in a foul. With Koufos not available, we had no one that could guard Gobert. Giles didn't do a horrible job, but it was an adventure with him out there. Just my humble opinion.

 

[Livinthedream]

At least we've moved past WCS being the worst player ever. Now we're pretty much complaining that he's not an all star type of center. I'll take it.

 

[The_Jamal]

Soooooo

Good enough?

What's wrong with asking him to do more? It's well within his ability. And I would argue it would have a massively positive impact for the team.

You sighted we are 6.2 points better defensively with him on the floor....you dont want to see 10 points better? 12 better?

Yeah, I'm extremely happy with WCS production this season because I have realistic expectations for who he is as a player. He's not Davis, Embiid, Gobert or any other star C. He's never going to be a superstar who you build your team around or have that sort of impact (which you're suggesting he should be when you say we should be 10+ points better with him on the floor defensively).

But right now, he's playing like a playoff caliber starting center. We're a significantly better team with him on the floor than with him off. His efficiency still needs to improve, but everything else is exactly what I want/expect out of him. How is that exactly not what we want him to be?

 

[bajaden]

Yeah, I'm extremely happy with WCS production this season because I have realistic expectations for who he is as a player. He's not Davis, Embiid, Gobert or any other star C. He's never going to be a superstar who you build your team around or have that sort of impact (which you're suggesting he should be when you say we should be 10+ points better with him on the floor defensively).

But right now, he's playing like a playoff caliber starting center. We're a significantly better team with him on the floor than with him off. His efficiency still needs to improve, but everything else is exactly what I want/expect out of him. How is that exactly not what we want him to be?

I think Willie suffers from the same stigma that many elite athlete's suffer from. Because they're elite athlete's, we tend to raise the bar higher than for an average athlete. Many elite athlete's never reach whatever potential that's been rightly or wrongly expected of them. The reasons are varied from athlete to athlete, but the result is the same. McLemore falls into that category. He's an elite athlete that just looks like he should be far better than he is. In Willie's case, as I have mentioned too many times already, he came to the game of basketball late, so he started out behind the curve.

When he arrived at Kentucky, he barely knew how to play the game. But Calipari was impressed with how quickly he picked up the game. None the less, he was far behind most of his teammates. In short, Willie has come a long way since then. If he can become a little more consistent, then I don't have a problem with resigning him. He's a perfect fit at center for the style the team is playing. Just don't exptect him to be Anthony Davis.

 

[VF21]

I used to be one of the meanest WCS detractors, because I was concerned about his motor and attitude. He is winning me over really fast.

If he is going to maintain this motor and attitude - if it is for real - then I want to give him the money. He can run and play in our style, with some theatric dunks, and a correct attitude.

I'm not gonna nitpick him if he is not a nightly double-double machine. He's doing more than enough to impress me this season.

You know, I seem to be seeing a lot of that around here from different posters about a variety of players (and the coach)...AND I LOVE IT!

This board is so much more fun when things are going in the right direction.

 

[ESP47]

Still really odd that he seems almost allergic to blocking shots but he's been doing everything else at a high clip so it's easy to look past it as long as he keeps the rest of his game up.

 

[Nokidding]

Still really odd that he seems almost allergic to blocking shots but he's been doing everything else at a high clip so it's easy to look past it as long as he keeps the rest of his game up.

Maybe if he was expanding energy on blocking shots he couldn't do those other things as well, I just don't know at this point the guy is playing well can't fault him but everyone that's watched him play can easily see he could and should average 2-3 blocks a game. It's a real strange one but like you say as long he he keeps the rest of his game up he's still beastly.

 

[The Hammer]

Still really odd that he seems almost allergic to blocking shots but he's been doing everything else at a high clip so it's easy to look past it as long as he keeps the rest of his game up.

It's a little maddening. I was an average height point guard in high school and my favorite play was getting blocks. Wasn't everybody's?? I can't relate to people who don't agree with that.

 

[Dime Dropper]

It's a little maddening. I was an average height point guard in high school and my favorite play was getting blocks. Wasn't everybody's?? I can't relate to people who don't agree with that.

You cannot seriously equate the two.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

I think Willie suffers from the same stigma that many elite athlete's suffer from. Because they're elite athlete's, we tend to raise the bar higher than for an average athlete. Many elite athlete's never reach whatever potential that's been rightly or wrongly expected of them. The reasons are varied from athlete to athlete, but the result is the same. McLemore falls into that category. He's an elite athlete that just looks like he should be far better than he is. In Willie's case, as I have mentioned too many times already, he came to the game of basketball late, so he started out behind the curve.

When he arrived at Kentucky, he barely knew how to play the game. But Calipari was impressed with how quickly he picked up the game. None the less, he was far behind most of his teammates. In short, Willie has come a long way since then. If he can become a little more consistent, then I don't have a problem with resigning him. He's a perfect fit at center for the style the team is playing. Just don't exptect him to be Anthony Davis.

This is spot on analysis. Regarding blocks, Willie just has poor timing when he’s on-ball. IMO, he’s prioritized positioning over shot blocking in order to reduce the risk of foul trouble—precisely because he knows he doesn’t have great timing. Shot blocking is not exactly an inherent trait, but some guys just have a knack for timing them right, and some guys don’t. Willie coming to the game late doesn’t help. For us, it’s better that he tracks his man and boxes out rather than pick up a cheap foul. And guess what, if he does that and Buddy or Fox gets the rebound, you have a very successful sequence for Willie that results in no stat accumulation for him.

Obviously, the greatest shot-blocker of all time , IMO, also came to the game late, but Hakeem was just a defensive maestro.

 

[ppine]

Against the Jazz, Willie was an offensive force with 23 points. I never thought he could do that on a regular basis. Very impressive.
Somewhat surprising.

He got 7 rebounds, the same as our starting PG and starting SG. Sure there are more long rebounds due to all of the 3 pt shots. Fox is the best rebounding point guard I have ever seen anywhere. Buddy is a great rebounder. That helps make up for Willie's very mediocre rebounding.

Bjelica gets in the paint and disrupts plays at the rim. Willie rarely does that. Fox will be the greatest shot blocking point guard in NBA history. Bagley is already very effective at blocking shots. In the NBA, you want any opposing player in the paint to be thinking about their shot being swatted into the third row. You want to plant that idea in the back of their minds early in the first quarter and reinforce the idea as often as you can. Willie has never shown that ability. We thought he would be able to do that. It is very important against some teams to play guys like Koufus, Bagley and Bjelica to get some blocks. Plant some doubt, and the shooting percentageby the opposition goes down.

I think Willie still plays like he is scared. It is his greatest weakness.

 

[Ozymandias]

It's a little maddening. I was an average height point guard in high school and my favorite play was getting blocks. Wasn't everybody's?? I can't relate to people who don't agree with that.

I'm with ya. The only thing to me more satisfying than a good block(especially on a jumpshot) was when I threw down my first few dunks, once that novelty wore off it was back to blocks.

This is not my biggest gripe with Willie though. As a UK fan I just have this image of Coach Cal screaming at the Willie teams "Grab the damn ball" (rebounds) ingrained in my mind, and tbh I just hope there's someone in his ear saying exactly that, cuz he needs it.

 

[Kingster]

This is spot on analysis. Regarding blocks, Willie just has poor timing when he’s on-ball. IMO, he’s prioritized positioning over shot blocking in order to reduce the risk of foul trouble—precisely because he knows he doesn’t have great timing. Shot blocking is not exactly an inherent trait, but some guys just have a knack for timing them right, and some guys don’t. Willie coming to the game late doesn’t help. For us, it’s better that he tracks his man and boxes out rather than pick up a cheap foul. And guess what, if he does that and Buddy or Fox gets the rebound, you have a very successful sequence for Willie that results in no stat accumulation for him.

Obviously, the greatest shot-blocker of all time , IMO, also came to the game late, but Hakeem was just a defensive maestro.

If you're right that some guys have the knack and some guys don't, then it would be a safe bet that Bagley at age 19 has the knack.

 

[Kingster]

Against the Jazz, Willie was an offensive force with 23 points. I never thought he could do that on a regular basis. Very impressive.
Somewhat surprising.

He got 7 rebounds, the same as our starting PG and starting SG. Sure there are more long rebounds due to all of the 3 pt shots. Fox is the best rebounding point guard I have ever seen anywhere. Buddy is a great rebounder. That helps make up for Willie's very mediocre rebounding.

Bjelica gets in the paint and disrupts plays at the rim. Willie rarely does that. Fox will be the greatest shot blocking point guard in NBA history. Bagley is already very effective at blocking shots. In the NBA, you want any opposing player in the paint to be thinking about their shot being swatted into the third row. You want to plant that idea in the back of their minds early in the first quarter and reinforce the idea as often as you can. Willie has never shown that ability. We thought he would be able to do that. It is very important against some teams to play guys like Koufus, Bagley and Bjelica to get some blocks. Plant some doubt, and the shooting percentageby the opposition goes down.

I think Willie still plays like he is scared. It is his greatest weakness.

I largely agree with your post. He still hasn't found that extra shot-blocking gear. Maybe it's just wishful thinking on my part, but I think that the specialness of Fox might eventually give WCS the added confidence he needs. (Even on his shooting he often hesitates when he shouldn't). When you know you have a super player on your team that can bail you out of bad situations, life becomes much easier.

 

[ppine]

O

If you're right that some guys have the knack and some guys don't, then it would be a safe bet that Bagley at age 19 has the knack.

Oh Bagley has it alright. But how could a fast human 7 feet tall, that gest off his feet quickly not block some shots once in awhile? Fox has great hop and great timing. He may get more blocks than Willie this year. He will get close to the same number of rebounds in most games. Buddy may be the leading rebounder in some games. This is not right and not only that it ain't right.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

O

Oh Bagley has it alright. But how could a fast human 7 feet tall, that gest off his feet quickly not block some shots once in awhile? Fox has great hop and great timing. He may get more blocks than Willie this year. He will get close to the same number of rebounds in most games. Buddy may be the leading rebounder in some games. This is not right and not only that it ain't right.

Guys show the ball to Fox alot more too, though. I wish WCS was blocking more shots, but I don’t think it’s terribly important to his, or the team’s, overall success. It would be a nice to have. But, his agility and lateral quickness allows him to track guys and create “contested” shots that other bigs would have no chance of bothering.

BTW, shot blocking has ironically little to do with jumping ability and really is more about BBIQ, length and timing.