Luka Doncic (pre and post-draft discussion thread)

[Dime Dropper]

Couldn't disagree more with this. Finding similar comps with current era NBA players is a great way not to mess up in the draft. The more comparisons you can find, the better. Body type, athleticism, and skill set comps are all about projecting how a player might translate. That translate part is what I think the Doncic crowd is missing. Certain player types historically have had issues translating there pre NBA success to the NBA. From Christian latener to Tyler hansborough to jimmer fredette. Super Stars at a lower level of competition go on to struggle in the nba. Doesn't mean Luka will, just means there are legitimate questions as not a lot of guys with his size and athletic profile have done it.

You are 100% wrong, comparisons are absolute nonsense, but you're convinced otherwise. They don't happen or matter in any other sport I can think of, but for some reason, it's important in the NBA. Despite absolutely zero of the comparisons turning out correct. You're apparently hanging your hat on comparing Mitchell to Bledsloe, which is a pretty terrible comparison, apart from the fact that they're both similar sizes. But you do you. Doesn't mean you're correct in the slightest.

 

[roasthawg]

You are 100% wrong, comparisons are absolute f**king nonsense, but you're convinced otherwise. They don't happen or matter in any other sport I can think of, but for some reason, it's important in the NBA. Despite absolutely zero of the comparisons turning out correct. You're apparently hanging your hat on comparing Mitchell to Bledsloe, which is a pretty terrible comparison, apart from the fact that they're both similar sizes. But you do you. Doesn't mean you're correct in the slightest.

Nah, you're the one that's missing the bigger picture on this one. Comparisons have nothing to do with getting it right as far as what the player will look like in the NBA. No two players look the same. It's about guessing how well they translate by looking at comps with similar size/athleticism/skill levels. Jjj compares well to Kat or even ad. Doesn't mean he'll play like either of them, just that best case is his overall level of impact can be on par with those players.

 

[Dime Dropper]

Nah, you're the one that's missing the bigger picture on this one. Comparisons have nothing to do with getting it right as far as what the player will look like in the NBA. No two players look the same. It's about guessing how well they translate by looking at comps with similar size/athleticism/skill levels. Jjj compares well to Kat or even ad. Doesn't mean he'll play like either of them, just that best case is his overall level of impact can be on par with those players.

OK cool, so even though no two players look the same, comparisons are still important. Makes sense.

Don't conflate two issues. Assessing the level of success of a prospect at the next level has absolutely nothing to do with player comparisons. Don't confuse yourself.

 

[Hansel]

Certain player types historically have had issues translating there pre NBA success to the NBA. From Christian latener to Tyler hansborough to jimmer fredette. Super Stars at a lower level of competition go on to struggle in the

Sergio Tavcar, an Italian journalist with clear Slovenian roots says "Basketball is a simple sport for smart people. If you don't get it, just give up". Please, don't ask me to explain. Lower level... Euroleague, National teams.

Half of the league is trying to trade up to get Doncic, but we are smarter. We proved it several times, didn't we?

 

[SacTownKid]

Christian Laettner made an all-star team and had more than a few close to all-star level years before injuries set in. His game translated about as well as it could from Duke.

 

[roasthawg]

Christian Laettner made an all-star team and had more than a few close to all-star level years before injuries set in. His game translated about as well as it could from Duke.

Yeah he had an alright career. But he was maxed out year one in the nba, no room for growth. His lack of athleticism held him back. He was a super star at a lower level but a journeyman in the NBA. Not a bad player, just not a guy we want at #2.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

https://community.kingsfans.com/threads/your-top-ten.67632/page-2#post-1327521

Here's my post from last year where I justified my ranking Mitchell in my top ten by comping him to Bledsoe. Pretty sure we're not allowed to talk about race but since you brought it up, yeah white guys. There's a reason there's very few all star level white players in the league and that reason isn't a lack of skill... It's a lack of athleticism. Luka has the same issue to overcome as those other guys. It's not something to ignore.

Wait... that he brought up?

You made a post where you commented on players who weren't able to make their pre-NBA success translate to the NBA, and the only players you named as examples were white, but he brought it up?

 

[roasthawg]

Wait... that he brought up?

You made a post where you commented on players who weren't able to make their pre-NBA success translate to the NBA, and the only players you named as examples were white, but he brought it up?

Yeah he brought it up. I mentioned players, not race. I'm more than happy to include race in the discussion but thought it was off limits on this board. Get it?

 

[Hansel]

We just learned a top pick shouldn't be white

 

[roasthawg]

We just learned a top pick shouldn't be white

It's obvious who the better NBA prospect is between those two!

 

[Hansel]

It's obvious who the better NBA prospect is between those two!

I just remember the guy on the left won... Like Doncic did.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Yeah he brought it up. I mentioned players, not race. I'm more than happy to include race in the discussion but thought it was off limits on this board. Get it?

No he didn't, you did. You don't get to say that you didn't bring it up first, just because you didn't use the word "white." That's not how this works. If all you were doing was listing guys whose pre-NBA success didn't translate, and you weren't trying to bring race into it, there's a ton of other guys you could have also used. I mean, Ben McLemore was sitting right there!

 

[roasthawg]

No he didn't, you did. You don't get to say that you didn't bring it up first, just because you didn't use the word "white." That's not how this works. If all you were doing was listing guys whose pre-NBA success didn't translate, and you weren't trying to bring race into it, there's a ton of other guys you could have also used. I mean, Ben McLemore was sitting right there!

Yeah that's exactly how it works... It's called following the rules of the board. Correct me if I'm wrong here but pretty sure it's ok to make prospect to player comparisons. Pretty sure it's also not ok to bring race into the discussion. Am I missing something? I did one without doing the other. You have a problem with that?

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Yeah, you are missing something. What you're missing is the part where you think we're going to fall for the banana in the tailpipe. You're trying to talk in code, and then play innocent. You're not going to convince anybody that the only players that you could think of to compare Luka Doncic to just happened to be white. *EDIT* - Especially when all three of the guys you mentioned play different positions!

We don't believe you. You need more people.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Banana in the tailpipe. Case closed.

 

[SLAB]

I've always compared Luka Doncic to Jason Williams, Vlade Divac, Brad Miller, and Birdman Anderson.

 

[Telemachus]

Yeah, you are missing something. What you're missing is the part where you think we're going to fall for the banana in the tailpipe. You're trying to talk in code, and then play innocent. You're not going to convince anybody that the only players that you could think of to compare Luka Doncic to just happened to be white. *EDIT* - Especially when all three of the guys you mentioned play different positions!

We don't believe you. You need more people.

Throw in the fact that none of them play even remotely similar to Doncic.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I've always compared Luka Doncic to Jason Williams, Vlade Divac, Brad Miller, and Birdman Anderson.

That's Andersen. Put some Respeck on that man's name!

 

[roasthawg]

Yeah, you are missing something. What you're missing is the part where you think we're going to fall for the banana in the tailpipe. You're trying to talk in code, and then play innocent. You're not going to convince anybody that the only players that you could think of to compare Luka Doncic to just happened to be white.

We don't believe you. You need more people.

I picked NCAA players of the year who weren't able to dominate the next level due to a lack of high level athleticism. I wasn't trying to fool anyone or talk in code. I can make a point with talking about race and that's what I was trying to accomplish. If I was allowed to talk about race I would've came right out with it a long time ago, but we're not supposed to. At the same time we're talking about taking a European #2 overall... Precious few superstars with a background like that. I'm doing the best I can to have a real discussion without offending anyone. If that includes making comparisons I don't believe in for the sake of political correctness then I'm out. In the meantime I'm gonna bring up the players that I think should be considered when talking about how Luka's game may or may not translate

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I picked NCAA players of the year who weren't able to dominate the next level due to a lack of high level athleticism.

So, you were cool going all the way back to Christian Laettner, but Calbert Cheaney gets a pass? What part of the game is this? *EDIT* - For that matter, I must have missed all the "dominating" that Shane Battier and Jameer Nelson have done at the NBA level... Evan Turner "dominate" anyone lately?

And poor Sean May, feeling all neglected with his meager Final Four MOP, wishing you had widened the search parameters, just a wee bit.

 

[Section 101]

Yeah, you are missing something. What you're missing is the part where you think we're going to fall for the banana in the tailpipe. You're trying to talk in code, and then play innocent. You're not going to convince anybody that the only players that you could think of to compare Luka Doncic to just happened to be white. *EDIT* - Especially when all three of the guys you mentioned play different positions!

We don't believe you. You need more people.

Actually the best comparison is .... Magic Johnson. 6'8", ball handler/play maker.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Actually the best comparison is .... Magic Johnson. 6'8", ball handler/play maker.

Shhh! Don't give up the game, shorty!

 

[roasthawg]

So, you were cool going all the way back to Christian Laettner, but Calbert Cheaney gets a pass? What part of the game is this?

And poor Sean May, feeling all neglected with his meager Final Four MOP, wishing you had widened the search parameters, just a wee bit.

I came off the top of my head... And my search criteria did include race. I was trying to make a point without breaking any rules.

Here's Larry Bird's take on the issue lol:
http://www.espn.com/nba/news/story?id=1818396

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I came off the top of my head... And my search criteria did include race. I was trying to make a point without breaking any rules.

Of course you did, that's why I knew what you doing. You were trying to get us to fall for the banana in the tailpipe.

Well, this has been a fun way to kill an hour. Now, if you don't mind, I'd like to get back to not caring about Luka F. Doncic.

 

[roasthawg]

Of course you did, that's why I knew what you doing. You were trying to get us to fall for the banana in the tailpipe.

Dude, I was trying to follow the rules lol. I don't know anything about bananas in tailpipes but if they're out of bounds let me know! No slight of hand or deception here

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

You were trying to interject race into the discussion, without using the words "race" or "white." You as much as said so. That's "following the rules" the same way a kid holds his finger in front of your face and says, "I'm not touching you!" over and over. You may have 'technically' been following the rules, but you weren't fooling anybody.

 

[funkykingston]

It's obvious who the better NBA prospect is between those two!

I hope you mean Woody because he could actually hoop. Wesley did not look natural in any of the basketball scenes.

 

[VF21]

Could we just get back to a discussion of Luka Doncic (the title of the thread) without all this other crap? Seriously?

 

[VF21]

Dude, I was trying to follow the rules lol. I don't know anything about bananas in tailpipes but if they're out of bounds let me know! No slight of hand or deception here

No, you weren't. You've been around here long enough to know that playing the race card (for ANY race) is not gonna fly. Never has, never will. Mr. S£im has been a lot more tolerant than I would have been had I been here the whole time.

 

[roasthawg]

No, you weren't. You've been around here long enough to know that playing the race card (for ANY race) is not gonna fly. Never has, never will. Mr. S£im has been a lot more tolerant than I would have been had I been here the whole time.

I didn't play the friggin race card. I mentioned players of the same race. I'll keep doing that too as those types of players (athletically, not racially) are relevant. Sorry I'm not including the Sean Mays of the world, that was a decent pull by slim but doesn't necessarily spring to mind. He was fat anyways, different category altogether. Anyways, I don't want to talk about this anymore but I feel like I have to everytime you mods quote me. If I've broken a rule then feel free to do something about it. If not let's please drop it