2016 NBA Draft Discussion
- Thread starter Dime Dropper
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And once Dunn and Buddy were off the board, NO ONE left at #8 would have helped us next year!
Clearly, Vlade did not see the value of drafting a project like Chriss at #8.
Very simple math, you can have one player with potential, upside, and also a project (Chriss) OR you can have 4 players with roughly the same potential and upside (Brodjan, Papa, Richardson and Skal).
I like our odds better with 4 upside players vs. 1 player.
Clearly, Vlade did not see the value of drafting a project like Chriss at #8.
Very simple math, you can have one player with potential, upside, and also a project (Chriss) OR you can have 4 players with roughly the same potential and upside (Brodjan, Papa, Richardson and Skal).
I like our odds better with 4 upside players vs. 1 player.
Considering last season people were blasting Vlade for getting rid of chances at building through the draft to free up cap space to build for the present, you can't then get angry at him for doing both this year.
OK, we get it. Vlade is an idiot and your a frigging genius. My god, will you just stop for a minute. Look, I get that your disappointed, but the negativism just wears on me after a while. I mean what the hell are we supposed to do? Blow our brains out? Do really think that Vlade was just sitting there staring blankly at his sheet saying my god, what are we going to do? Really? I mean REALLY? Did it ever occur to you that Vlade wanted to draft Papagiannis and that was his plan B? Or do you think he just reached into a jar an pulled out a name?
I remember the exact same thing happening when Petrie walked out on the stage and said the Kings had drafted Peja. Petrie was the most hated man in Sacramento at that moment. But guess what? He was right! So how about we wait and see how this turns out before we commit mass sucide.
I remember the exact same thing happening when Petrie walked out on the stage and said the Kings had drafted Peja. Petrie was the most hated man in Sacramento at that moment. But guess what? He was right! So how about we wait and see how this turns out before we commit mass sucide.
And once Dunn and Buddy were off the board, NO ONE left at #8 would have helped us next year!
Clearly, Vlade did not see the value of drafting a project like Chriss at #8.
Very simple math, you can have one player with potential, upside, and also a project (Chriss) OR you can have 4 players with roughly the same potential and upside (Brodjan, Papa, Richardson and Skal).
I like our odds better with 4 upside players vs. 1 upside player.
Clearly, Vlade did not see the value of drafting a project like Chriss at #8.
Very simple math, you can have one player with potential, upside, and also a project (Chriss) OR you can have 4 players with roughly the same potential and upside (Brodjan, Papa, Richardson and Skal).
I like our odds better with 4 upside players vs. 1 upside player.
What's mind boggling is why give up Stauskas and 2019 1st round pick to win now and then in next year draft projects/players who won't even come over?
Absolutely we can.
Be consistent! We committed to win now when we gave up Nik and the unprotected 2019 for cap space to add vets. Now we had a chance to draft some seriously nice guard prospects that fill major needs on our team right now and could help us from day 1, but we pass in favor of home-run potential (I use that term loosely) and guys who project to contribute years away? If at all?
I'm still hoping we drafted these guys for someone else and a deal is in the works. Because we did absolutely nothing to convince Cousins we're adding pieces for us to get to the playoffs next year. And if we're not trading Boogie (which is looking more and more doubtful by t
Be consistent! We committed to win now when we gave up Nik and the unprotected 2019 for cap space to add vets. Now we had a chance to draft some seriously nice guard prospects that fill major needs on our team right now and could help us from day 1, but we pass in favor of home-run potential (I use that term loosely) and guys who project to contribute years away? If at all?
I'm still hoping we drafted these guys for someone else and a deal is in the works. Because we did absolutely nothing to convince Cousins we're adding pieces for us to get to the playoffs next year. And if we're not trading Boogie (which is looking more and more doubtful by t
Yes I can say that because unless we got one of the guys drafted before pick 8, there was no one what would come in and be an instant help from this draft. Vlade pretty much said we wanted Dunn so all PGs that we liked were gone by 13. What we did was pick as much talent as we possibly could. What this does is gives us trade chips and talent to develop. It also gives us potential to deal some veteran pieces from the current roster to help make the roster better for next season.
We traded Bellineli because he didn't want to be here. We clear out some cap space that way. We get some kids that could help but keep in mind that next year we are unlikely to have first round pick so what we did was stash young players that with development can help us overcome that. I am very happy with Bogdanovic because when he comes over, he is a ready made player who comes in and can give us what we need, whether that is coming off the bench or possibly starting.
What we essentially did was increase our assets because we didn't like anyone at 8 that could be instant help. We were never going to get that instant help from the draft. It was always going to be about trades and free agency for us. This is part 1 of the work. Let's wait and see what we have in October. Things will look very different then I am certain.
We traded Bellineli because he didn't want to be here. We clear out some cap space that way. We get some kids that could help but keep in mind that next year we are unlikely to have first round pick so what we did was stash young players that with development can help us overcome that. I am very happy with Bogdanovic because when he comes over, he is a ready made player who comes in and can give us what we need, whether that is coming off the bench or possibly starting.
What we essentially did was increase our assets because we didn't like anyone at 8 that could be instant help. We were never going to get that instant help from the draft. It was always going to be about trades and free agency for us. This is part 1 of the work. Let's wait and see what we have in October
. Things will look very different then I am certain.Again, so what? He was an excellent pick in that spot, in a position of great need for us. If we're trying to improve the team now with Boogie, that was an easy pick.
Look, the trades were fantastic. We got awesome value for the 8th pick and Belli. I already said I wouldn't mind this draft at all if we were trying to rebuild. But this draft, if we keep it, makes the Sixers trade looks even worse and adds next to nothing to help Boogie win games next season.
The fact is we stacked positions with complete project players that we were basically already set at with KK, WCS and Boogie when we had an opportunity to add much needed depth to the back-court depth and guys who were far more ready to play from day 1 and help keep Boogie here. I'll say it again, if we aren't packaging our guys for some vet help or trading Boogie, I've lost a ton of faith in this FO ability to put a cohesive plan together.
Look, the trades were fantastic. We got awesome value for the 8th pick and Belli. I already said I wouldn't mind this draft at all if we were trying to rebuild. But this draft, if we keep it, makes the Sixers trade looks even worse and adds next to nothing to help Boogie win games next season.
The fact is we stacked positions with complete project players that we were basically already set at with KK, WCS and Boogie when we had an opportunity to add much needed depth to the back-court depth and guys who were far more ready to play from day 1 and help keep Boogie here. I'll say it again, if we aren't packaging our guys for some vet help or trading Boogie, I've lost a ton of faith in this FO ability to put a cohesive plan together.
Yep. If Vlade pulls in a free agent haul of Courtney Lee, E'twaun Moore, and Matt Barnes, and re-signs a Seth Curry are the Kings all that worse off than they'd have been if they either (a) drafted Baldwin at 13 (good physical attributes but has yet shown to be capable of running an NBA offense) or (b) somehow traded up for Dunn (solid draft choice but also older than most other prospects, also possible incapable of coming in and running an NBA offense). Hell, if all Vlade does is re-sign the guys from our squad last year, I'd argue that this team under a competent coach and with any contributions from our prospect class and subtracting the net suck of Marco and Anderson is in a much better place than last season.
Well they took a look at a position of need, so it wasn't like they didn't consider Baldwin at all pre workout.
Second, what lands at 8 determines what you can get back in return.
Different prospect there, maybe different results.
Vlade's been pretty candid, he didn't like anyone who fit a "need" that much at 13.
If you don't like what's on the table, can't get a trade to workout, what do you do?
Second, what lands at 8 determines what you can get back in return.
Different prospect there, maybe different results.
Vlade's been pretty candid, he didn't like anyone who fit a "need" that much at 13.
If you don't like what's on the table, can't get a trade to workout, what do you do?
I've long held that unless that player you're looking at is also the best player available, you always draft for talent and potential over need. Drafting for need gives you Thomas Robinson when the top player on your draft board was Dame Lillard. If you draft the best player available and he turns into a stud, you can work things out from there but if you draft a guy based on need who turns into dud, you're pretty much screwed until his contract expires.
Yes I can say that because unless we got one of the guys drafted before pick 8, there was no one what would come in and be an instant help from this draft. Vlade pretty much said we wanted Dunn so all PGs that we liked were gone by 13. What we did was pick as much talent as we possibly could. What this does is gives us trade chips and talent to develop. It also gives us potential to deal some veteran pieces from the current roster to help make the roster better for next season.
We traded Bellineli because he didn't want to be here. We clear out some cap space that way. We get some kids that could help but keep in mind that next year we are unlikely to have first round pick so what we did was stash young players that with development can help us overcome that. I am very happy with Bogdanovic because when he comes over, he is a ready made player who comes in and can give us what we need, whether that is coming off the bench or possibly starting.
What we essentially did was increase our assets because we didn't like anyone at 8 that could be instant help. We were never going to get that instant help from the draft. It was always going to be about trades and free agency for us. This is part 1 of the work. Let's wait and see what we have in October. Things will look very different then I am certain.
We traded Bellineli because he didn't want to be here. We clear out some cap space that way. We get some kids that could help but keep in mind that next year we are unlikely to have first round pick so what we did was stash young players that with development can help us overcome that. I am very happy with Bogdanovic because when he comes over, he is a ready made player who comes in and can give us what we need, whether that is coming off the bench or possibly starting.
What we essentially did was increase our assets because we didn't like anyone at 8 that could be instant help. We were never going to get that instant help from the draft. It was always going to be about trades and free agency for us. This is part 1 of the work. Let's wait and see what we have in October
. Things will look very different then I am certain.
Our goal this offseason was to put enough on the court to convince Boogie theres enough here to resign long-term. We added 2 project bigs, a Euro wing who won't be here for at least a year and another raw wing in Richardson who as 206fan said... Really isn't great at basically anything but does have decent upside. And relying on FA is a flat out bad strategy for us to add the impact talent we actually need.
Keeping Boogie with this draft is insanely poor team construction and management when Boogie is jumping out the door if this season doesn't go well.
I still need to understand who could have helped right from the beginning... Did we pass on some sure superstars that I didn't notice? I wanted Baldwin too, but I'm not so sure he would have been a key contributor for this team from day one.
Personally, the more I'm watching about Papa the more I'm ok with this pick. I'm sure that if he wasn't an euro prospect, he would had been a top 10 selection in this draft.
Personally, the more I'm watching about Papa the more I'm ok with this pick. I'm sure that if he wasn't an euro prospect, he would had been a top 10 selection in this draft.
We should also give Vlade lots of credit picking lots of dudes with awesome names tonight.
Papagiannis is already an all-time great name.
Bogdan's name is going to be great fun to hear various announcers butcher.
Malachi is the name of a kid whose parents probably watched way too much TV as a kid.
Skal just sounds badass.
Isaiah Cousins is cool for obvious reasons.
Papagiannis is already an all-time great name.
Bogdan's name is going to be great fun to hear various announcers butcher.
Malachi is the name of a kid whose parents probably watched way too much TV as a kid.
Skal just sounds badass.
Isaiah Cousins is cool for obvious reasons.
Entirely different situations but the Rockets already had Ralph Sampson when they drafted the Dream. Played them together, then when one opened the gap/the other guy started falling apart at the seams, traded one to build around the other.
Look, Papagiannis isn't an NBA-ready contributor like Boogie was, able to contribute 30 minutes a night right off the bat. But if you get him time when you can and he starts to show flashes, you can either clear up rotation time to put him in for more than 4-5 minute spurts or get a return on your investment through a trade.
We may not be able to have both guys but the day when we can only have one is still probably several years away and, at that point, if Papagiannis is so good that we're having to ask the question "How do we make things work with him and Boogie?", it's a good problem to have because it means we've drafted another stud (or Boogie has somehow forgotten how to play basketball, in which case we're screwed anyway).
Look, Papagiannis isn't an NBA-ready contributor like Boogie was, able to contribute 30 minutes a night right off the bat. But if you get him time when you can and he starts to show flashes, you can either clear up rotation time to put him in for more than 4-5 minute spurts or get a return on your investment through a trade.
We may not be able to have both guys but the day when we can only have one is still probably several years away and, at that point, if Papagiannis is so good that we're having to ask the question "How do we make things work with him and Boogie?", it's a good problem to have because it means we've drafted another stud (or Boogie has somehow forgotten how to play basketball, in which case we're screwed anyway).
I quit posting right after we picked Papagiannis, not because I was upset as everyone else seemed to be but because I think I saw what Vlade saw. At the best and I think it is reasonably likely, we have a young Vlade Divac. I hope we are that lucky. It will take years to know how he evolves but that's the way it is with all young guys and to continue out the comparison to Vlade, it's like Vlade. As I wrote a few hours ago, just because he isn't your favorite guy doesn't mean it was a bad pick. Oh, he's 7'2 1/4 " tall with a wingspan of 7'6". That's an awful lot of reach.
The bigger question is "why?" I understand that but we can afford to let the kid ferment. It might very well be worth it. This is Vlade picking a big Euro. How wrong could he be?
The other two guys are as good as you could find in this draft which I think was weak. Richardson has defensive potential and is the 3 and D kinda guy I hear everybody thinks we need. Give him time and let's see if he becomes that. It would be quite humorous if he turned out to be better than Ben or Nic.
I am not the greatest analyst in the world but I didn't expect us to come out of this draft with anything better than long shots. That's what happened. I kn0w people have been analyzing and analyzing but I wonder if in the process you forgot perspective. A #13 this year might be more like a #8 in other years. There are two good guys in this draft and that's it as far as I am concerned. Even Dunn had big holes in his game although I would have been happier if we picked him.
Now we learn if Vlade is a good judge of talent as well as the rest of his staff. We will learn if our coaches can bring along the guys worth putting effort into.
And, hey, no more Belinelli. He'll probably find his game now but I will never forget his interview where he pinpointed the troubles with the Kings and conveniently left out his lack of contribution. I suspect he was not much of a team guy.
I don't think this means we try to sign Rondo but that's a bigger story than I want to get into.
The bigger question is "why?" I understand that but we can afford to let the kid ferment. It might very well be worth it. This is Vlade picking a big Euro. How wrong could he be?
The other two guys are as good as you could find in this draft which I think was weak. Richardson has defensive potential and is the 3 and D kinda guy I hear everybody thinks we need. Give him time and let's see if he becomes that. It would be quite humorous if he turned out to be better than Ben or Nic.
I am not the greatest analyst in the world but I didn't expect us to come out of this draft with anything better than long shots. That's what happened. I kn0w people have been analyzing and analyzing but I wonder if in the process you forgot perspective. A #13 this year might be more like a #8 in other years. There are two good guys in this draft and that's it as far as I am concerned. Even Dunn had big holes in his game although I would have been happier if we picked him.
Now we learn if Vlade is a good judge of talent as well as the rest of his staff. We will learn if our coaches can bring along the guys worth putting effort into.
And, hey, no more Belinelli. He'll probably find his game now but I will never forget his interview where he pinpointed the troubles with the Kings and conveniently left out his lack of contribution. I suspect he was not much of a team guy.
I don't think this means we try to sign Rondo but that's a bigger story than I want to get into.
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